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| Hypothesis: Hospitals ARE The Vector @RealDonaldTrump in forum [Market-Ticker-Nad]
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Jack_crabb
Posts: 14251
Incept: 2010-06-25
Peoples' Republik of Maryland
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Molon Labe Where is Henry Bowman when you need him? How many are willing to pledge this? We mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes, and our Sacred Honor
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Workerbee
Posts: 4631
Incept: 2009-03-18
Never give in, never give up, never stop growing
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Yes!!!!!!!!! Preach!!!!! 
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"Keep pushing ****ers, you'll find the trip wire eventually" ~ Quik49
"This is the part where you find out who you are"
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Redjack
Posts: 1476
Incept: 2018-01-29
Iowa
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My kid was in the NICU for 71 days.
The nurses told me "Most infections in the NICU start with medical staff not washing their hands!"
I was an ABSOLUTE NAZI on making sure ANYONE touching my kid washed and sanitized their hands. To the point I told a doctor she WAS NOT going to touch her until I see her wash her damn hands.
My bear never had an infection, and should have been out sooner but the vent techs were pretty nervous on backing her off (once you get on a vent, it takes weeks to get off). Kid decided to pull her tube out, and the attending doc and vent tech sat in the room with her for a day to see if it would hold. It did.
What is interesting is my GP has gone to almost 100% online now. She said "we may be spreading this in the hospitals, and I am not doing it here!" For most things, that will work. For the exceptions that can't they are setting aside "clean" buildings for everyone else. But God have mercy if you get the flu.
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Pharmadude
Posts: 217
Incept: 2020-03-26
NC
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US health'scam' system is run by the TBTF banks, and not just the corporate run hospitals.
HHS along with the many state and local health departments, are essentially run by politicians sponsored/controlled by the TBTF banks.
The sheeple follow the politicians giving away the most and best goodies. Once every so often, the sheeple are scared and forced to their pens by the TPTB. Because everything is very, very "baa-d, baa-d"!
First comes the fleecing, soon followed by the slaughter.
Poor, poor sheeple; before they know it they're naked yet safe again. Some unlucky ones lost it all. For the lucky ones though, it's back to the secure pasture to live free, to grow more wool and to get fat once again.
However, the ruling class have nice new clothes and blankets to stay warm and full bellies.
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Pharmadude
Posts: 217
Incept: 2020-03-26
NC
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Google has had these same five simple steps out for weeks:
DO THE FIVE Help stop coronavirus 1. HANDS Wash them often 2. ELBOW Cough into it 3. FACE Don't touch it 4. SPACE Keep safe distance 5. HOME Stay if you can
If 1-4 are too hard to follow, then #5
Nothing about destroying the economy.
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Tickerguy
Posts: 185089
Incept: 2007-06-26
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The problem is that by definition all medical facilities always concentrate sick people into a confined, small space.
If what's wrong with them isn't infectious then this isn't a big deal. But if it is then you had better make ******ned sure you don't transmit anything between them or to and from yourself OR YOU BECOME THE LARGEST VECTOR INSTANTLY.
Well, the data says that is EXACTLY what is happening and the other "steps" are NOT making a difference.
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Civil Society requires 99%+ consent. Stop consenting and it is forced to stop. Always. No violence required.
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Twainfan2
Posts: 719
Incept: 2018-12-04
MN
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if only orange man listened. Let me correct that, if only orange man listened to common sense instead of the idiot brigade.
Hopefully there's someone in DC with some common sense that sees this and starts to ask some questions.
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Schoolboy13
Posts: 35
Incept: 2016-01-03
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Preach it, Mr. Denninger!
I'm an acute care RN that works with immuno-compromised patients (solid-organ transplants), and hand sanitizer isn't enough, especially when you're dealing with nasty bugs transmitted via the oral-fecal route. Wash your damn hands, people. Frequently. It's not rocket science.
Further, how many more lives are we putting at risk by crashing the entire world economy in response to the virus than by letting the virus run its course and taking appropriate precautions?
The media fear-mongering needs to stop!
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Tickerguy
Posts: 185089
Incept: 2007-06-26
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Yep.
The only way to get step-function linear line segments in what should be a parabolic curve is if there are concentration points where enough of the transmission is being initiated so what would otherwise be a smooth parabola is interrupted.
Well, we closed all those potential places - mass gathering, etc. All gone. Bars and restaurants aren't big enough to produce that sort of concentration point but we closed those too anyway and played "social distancing" in the (false) belief that this was where the transmission was coming from.
What's left?
HOSPITALS.
The step function line segments are still there and haven't changed. In fact they're what has driven the curve since the beginning of this.
Hospitals haven't taken over from other sources they've been the primary source since this started.
That's where it was always coming from.
****ers.
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Civil Society requires 99%+ consent. Stop consenting and it is forced to stop. Always. No violence required.
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Rickylc
Posts: 2612
Incept: 2009-02-09
Is Everywhere
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I was looking at this last night and wondered about the steps, China and Japan seem to be outliers to this. I assumed it was massaging the numbers.
China we know did that, and I figured Japan was also while the Olympics were still on the line.
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We know they are lying, they know they are lying, they know we know they are lying, we know they know we know they are lying, but they are still lying. - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
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Gianmarko
Posts: 238
Incept: 2013-03-11
Bern, Switzerland
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italy and spain have a very centralized and bureaucratic health care system. big hospitals and offices and people routinely have to queue for hours to get a piece of paper and then queue for more hours to deliver it to another office. and apparently they havent discovered stuff like "appointments" as is normal that you are told to show u at 8AM and then you have to spend hours in crowded waiting rooms. last year i was in spain in holidays and my son got sick with high fever. we had to spend some 10 hours in a waiting room of maybe 250 sqft together with at least 40 ppl. you can clearly see the results of all thisin the death toll. i have family in spain. one relative lives in a retirement house. one folk there got sick and was hospitalized. they tested him for the virus only after 4 days he was in, they had to quarantine the whole ward. 14 out of 50 ppl got infected and a few passed away already. italian and spanish hospitals are veritable bacteriological bombs. here in switzerland they were smart enough to close down hospitals quite early. first you call, then they will tell you what to do. it works much better.
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Pharmadude
Posts: 217
Incept: 2020-03-26
NC
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As our host has highlighted several times, case numbers are evident that some basic hygiene has not been followed. Hospitals have always been concentrated centers for disease, and spreading diseases from and within the hospital wards has been a 'problem' for a very long time. Quote (note stat from CDC): In American hospitals alone, the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) estimates that HAIs account for an estimated 1.7 million infections and 99,000 associated deaths each year. Of these infections: 32 percent of all acquired infection are urinary tract infections 22 percent are surgical site infections 15 percent are pneumonia (lung infections) 14 percent are bloodstream infections ... many HAIs can be prevented through the strict adherence to evidence-based best practices. Recommendations include: * healthcare providers cleaning their hands with soap and water or an alcohol-based hand rub before and after caring for every patient; * catheters being used only when necessary and removed as soon as possible; * cleaning the skin where the catheter is being inserted or the surgical site, and * providers wearing hair covers, masks, gowns and gloves when appropriate. Source: https://patientcarelink.org/improving-pa....
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Geckogm
Posts: 5832
Incept: 2007-06-26
Canyon Lake
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T7rader
Posts: 4
Incept: 2020-03-28
Carlsbad
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Karl- Long time reader but 1st time poster. I appreciate greatly your insights and views
It sees the most of the docs we're seeing on TV are referencing the social distancing that took place during 1918 and specifically showing the results of Philadelphia (did not implement and had a parade) versus St. Louis (did social distancing). Even if you take into consideration the different size of the population, the results were very dramatic. What would you say to counter the argument that social distancing did prove its benefits then?
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Workerbee
Posts: 4631
Incept: 2009-03-18
Never give in, never give up, never stop growing
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I have to admit our local hospitals instituted a lockdown almost immediately after this COVID hype began. It's damn near Hotel California style.....if ya go in, ya ain't coming out. Our local hospitals are reportedly ghost towns.. no one WANTS to go, even if they are sick. Of our 4 affiliated hospitals, only one will allow suspected and/or confirmed cases, and they are on one floor at the moment. And there were not many of as of yesterday's report. Also, one set of Doctors that visit our facility no longer visit physically, but by facetime as they are limiting their exposure at our facility because they are rounding at the hospitals.
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"Keep pushing ****ers, you'll find the trip wire eventually" ~ Quik49
"This is the part where you find out who you are"
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Mannfm11
Posts: 8226
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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So, the carriers are the very people we are begging for more. The curve ends when they all get sick, recover and wash their hands. This is a good explanation why Trump doesn't have it. It was already said he was an obsessive hand washer. Trump had the solution from the start.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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Tickerguy
Posts: 185089
Incept: 2007-06-26
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@T7rader - Quote:"Thats not to say that St. Louis survived the epidemic unharmed. Dehner says the midwestern city was hit particularly hard by the third wave of the Spanish flu which returned in the late winter and spring of 1919" They concentrated the nasty strains and got ****ed the next year. The problem is that eventually you HAVE TO remove the curbs and when you do the infection comes back. If, as with most influenza bugs, it's seasonal then what do you do NEXT fall? If it's not then what? Keep them forever and live with a permanently destroyed economy? For a seasonal bug you MIGHT get some benefit. But assuming R0 is a constant so is the suppression point with immunity in the population. If R0 is NOT a constant (e.g. you're getting a LOT of transmission in the hospitals, for example) you WANT to keep people out of the damned hospital as that's how you depress R0 enough so that herd immunity hits the threshold FASTER. You CAN'T do two+ months of an economic shutdown. You just can't. Further, even if you did, GO RUN THE MATH -- it doesn't matter because while you suppress R0 when you drop it you're no further along with herd immunity. All of these premises count on a vaccine rescuing you. There has never been a persistent-immunity coronavirus vaccine.Note that we were promised the same bull**** with HIV. It's nearly 40 years later -- where's the vaccine?
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Civil Society requires 99%+ consent. Stop consenting and it is forced to stop. Always. No violence required.
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Bluemarrow
Posts: 38
Incept: 2009-06-14
Earth
Banned
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"Well, we closed all those potential places - mass gathering, etc"
From the moment the President declared a state of emergency, two things happened:
CostCo, Sams, Walmart, Target, and all grocery stores were mobbed. Crowds gathered at the front doors and stormed the aisles when the doors were opened.
At the same time, hospitals became ghost towns. My Niece is an ICU nurse who moonlights in the ER of a 1,000 bed hospital in Central Illinois. She says that even now, the ER is less than half as busy as normal, because all of the people who normally use the ER as a walk in clinic for non emergent attention, and the drug seekers, are afraid to come in. She began to see an uptick in "R/O C19 beginning Tuesday, but the hospital is otherwise well below normal census.
Incidentally, the hospital admin told her she can't wear the N95s that she bought for herself, and that she needs to turn them over so that they have enough for the Doctors and Residents, even though they don't even go in the ICU rooms of her C19 patients. She heard that yesterday, and is currently deciding whether or not she's going to erect the middle finger, and quit.
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Bagbalm
Posts: 6490
Incept: 2009-03-19
Just North of Detroit
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Look at the list of doctors in your hospital. Unclean left handers like crazy. I had one of those third world docs give me an infection because he couldn't be bothered to give me prophylactic antibiotics for a very invasive biopsy. My regular doc was furious.
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Workerbee
Posts: 4631
Incept: 2009-03-18
Never give in, never give up, never stop growing
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Bluemarrow, that is bull****! Your niece should contact every news outlet and spread her story on social media.
I hope that hospital admin DIAF ASAP while suffering from c diff,anal fissures, COVID and bubonic plague. That's pitchfork and torches criteria for me.
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"Keep pushing ****ers, you'll find the trip wire eventually" ~ Quik49
"This is the part where you find out who you are"
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Clay3482
Posts: 2027
Incept: 2008-11-13
Alaska
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I agree KD.
My mom has this.
But this is exactly why we decided as a family not to take her to the hospital. She did get emergency treatment one time with Oxygen but no one, not even the doctor would come into the room, they stood at the door.
One nurse who is a family friend and has known my mom since she was born was the only person allowed in the room. She washed her hands and had new ppe and did not leave until my mom was discharged.
Stay out of the hospitals. They can not do anything.
IMHO Try to get antibiotics, hydroxyclonaquin and / or Oxygen if you have to have anything. Try to stay out of the hospital because there is nothing they can do. A vent will not help and chances are you will get infected with something else at the hospital while you are trying to get well and you will die.
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Happyapricot
Posts: 97
Incept: 2019-07-06
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My question is, is it safe to go to the store? I really don't need anything, but there are a few things I would like. But they are not worth dying for.
I don't know how to time this. In my state there are only around 50 confirmed cases. At this rate it will probably be another month or two before they lock down.
Do you buy supplies now before the first wave or wait? Do you risk being one of the people sick in the first wave? How do you use the data from the vectors?
Is it safer to order online and let the supplies sit in the box?
I did place an order and they ship almost everything in a separate box and ship from a different state. I had soup traveling from the west coast and ritz crackers coming in from the left coast. It doesn't really seem safe. But then again, do you risk walking down the store isles? I don't know.....
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Ktrosper
Posts: 5537
Incept: 2010-04-06
ft collins co
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Mannfm wrote..So, the carriers are the very people we are begging for more. AND the people who benefit the most financially from spreading it... Perverse incentive there.
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The unexamined life is not worth living.-Socrates The only stable state is the one in which all men are equal before the law.-Aristotle Liberty exists now in the spaces government has not yet chosen to occupy.-Doc Zero I anticipate that 10 Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders will blow me this evening.-K.D.
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Drifter
Posts: 1331
Incept: 2016-02-11
Pacific Northwest
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Vectors-- I feel badly for people that own restaurants, but one benefit of this 'social distancing' is that, I would imagine anyway, fewer people are eating out. Fewer people eating out means fewer people getting exposed to food touched by dirty hands, from fields, to Food Service of America, to the restaurant, and to your t-go order.
I know quite a few people that like to just pop in and eat lunch at the local hospital cafeteria. They are f'ing insane.
So in a hospital setting-- who is the real vector for Wuhan: medical personnel, food service or all of the above? What ****show ****storm.
If I had a loved one in that place, I would bring them food from home.
From what I gather... with little data, health departments track who covid people come in contact with, but are they also tracking *what* they came in contact with? In other words, are the government worker bees asking the right questions? My hunch is-- no.
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