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 Finding Allies
Tickerguy 192k posts, incept 2007-06-26
2023-01-19 10:49:32

@Mrunivac my problem with the "religious exemption" is that its fundamentally untruthful. The argument that the jabs were tested with cell lines derived from an aborted fetus is so far out of the realm of reason that it fails a basic logic test, but what's much worse is that having filed and swore to it being accurate and, presumably, being in your chart you ought to expect that any future pharmaceutical you might otherwise be prescribed or want to use is denied you on that basis.

You didn't argue that it was JUST the clotshot, of course, because a religious exemption is just that. Well, virtually ALL modern pharmaceutical products are in fact tested against those cell lines. So when you're in a hospital and need an IV NOW that contains such, if its denied you then you have no room to complain.

If you're SELECTIVE about the objection then its not the cell lines that you're objecting to and, if you do that, you just admitted to committing fraud. Maybe you get away with that and maybe you don't but that's the same bullshit that people run about not being willing to deport illegals because their strawberries will cost an extra 10 cents a quart and they think that is more important than girl in Iowa being raped and killed by said illegals.

If you want to play dirty that's fine, and I understand it. But beyond the ethics and personal standard perspective if you think that can't be turned around you're utterly full of shit and are very likely to get a NASTY surprise.

The difference between "kill" and "murder" is that murder, as a subset of kill, is undeserved by the deceased.
Shadowmask 4k posts, incept 2021-05-24
2023-01-19 10:59:18

Asking for a religious exemption means you're asking permission to have faith.

You are a slave at that point.

But you do you.

Sportsball Team A: 3 Sportsball Team B: 3
Clot Shot: 0
Mrbobo 107 posts, incept 2021-12-01
2023-01-19 10:59:34

@Forever_young, whatever dude. Apparently you can't even qualify blanket generalizations anymore :P
I was never going to take the jab for all the reasons too long to list. I had a pretty cushy job and in what I think was weakness I placed a medical exemption (technically an ADA accomodation as T1 diabetes is covered) ticket in the queue. I am not a religious man but I believe I have a decent set of ethics and morals (i.e. don't lie, cheat, or steal). That made any religious exemption path a non-starter. So perhaps you have a point in the sense that I was being disingenuous as my condition requires no accommodation. I mostly wanted to have the Trifecta of ADA, discrimination, and hostile workplace violations communicated.
I'm not questioning your piety, but I would ask were you not taking the jab for religious reasons or is that just the vehicle you used to save your job? White lies are still lies.
Margbp 138 posts, incept 2021-12-02
2023-01-19 11:07:08

Nobody had any reasonable expectation that anyone else would back their play, so it was every man for himself.


My daughter was immediately fired for refusing to mask up when her boss mandated it after months of not requiring it during the state mandate. No one came to her defense.

I've since learned enough about her ex- boss to conclude he's probably a narcissist. People put up with him. No one stood up to him. Because of her position my daughter never ran into problems or witnessed any trouble. What she heard was infrequent enough that she didn't see a pattern.

So these coworkers were already conditioned to go along to get along.

I think generally most people are and have been for decades.

Most people "believe" in vaccines. And for the most part, as Karl has explained, that's been effective. But that came after decades of study & research. This time around the shot was called a vaccine and people lined up without even questioning the ability to make a vaccine in less than a year and no long term study. They didn't have to think and didn't want to. People don't understand that the things they believe in exist because they were supported by a solid foundation. Now all they want is the latest "thing" so you better not stop them.

No the vaccine response wasn't surprising. It should have been expected. In a nation fighting for abortion at all cost and sexual kicks no matter what including same sex marriage and protecting public perversions there was no line to cross. That disappeared a long time ago.

So I wasn't surprised by those in my orbit who signed up to be Guinea pigs. They'd always been that way.

It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his desires depend upon his not understanding it.
~Upton Sinclair slightly paraphrased
Bodhi 5k posts, incept 2008-02-23
2023-01-19 11:13:16

Speedpolkabrewer wrote..
My dad, who for all my life was a far right republican, was on time for every shot and booster. Tried his best to pressure me to get it.

My then 90 y.o. dad insisted on getting the 2-shot Pfizer jab. He is also a lifelong far right republican. He Never got boosted. I blame the constant vaxx propaganda on Faux News for his decision. At least he only asked if I was getting the jab and I said, "No way." He dropped it after that.

Both my siblings avoided the jab, as well as my sister's husband and 3 sons. Most of us had the coof last spring, but fairly easily fought it off.

Most other family members got the jab. Some because they caved to the constant pressure. Some, like one of my cousins, got the jab as she was caregiver for my elderly aunt and uncle. We still talk and have a good relationship.

My best friend of 50+ years got the jab as he is facing a second surgery to repair an aortic dissection. This definitely seems ass backwards to require a heart patient to take the jab. He is on the blood thinner Warfarin, so maybe this is the only thing keeping him from thudding. Time will tell.

Be so subtle that you are invisible.
Be so mysterious that you are intangible.
Then you will control your rivals' fate.
~Sun Tzu, The Art of War

Reason: formatting
Mrunivac 2 posts, incept 2023-01-19
2023-01-19 11:33:17

@Tickerguy Noted, and fair enough. There was a follow-up question on my request about whether my beliefs would impact taking other vaccines or treatments, and my response was that if it were both in any way connected to abortion and compelled under threat of force, I would refuse. If I roll snake eyes on that, so be it. I meant what I said in that request and I'm not one to shy away from the consequences of my actions.
Tickerguy 192k posts, incept 2007-06-26
2023-01-19 11:42:48

As I pointed out at the time @Mrunivac the only HONEST exemption on religious grounds would be to state that all of the existing and approved jabs work through genetic tampering within the cells of the injected person's body and that your personal religious beliefs are that God ("higher power", whatever) was responsible for this design. You believe said higher power is greater than humans and in fact responsible for the existence of all life on this rock and we not only cannot we do not at present claim complete understanding of any part of it. Thus to tamper with same in this fashion is to violate the sanctity of said higher power's design and commands.

That you refuse to do as such an act exposes you to damnation -- which you would have earned by doing so.

It's truthful as well in all respects, except perhaps to what you attribute the command and does not implicate any other drugs or, for that matter, "traditional" vaccines such as MMR or even the current flu shot. It DOES implicate any future "cellular reprogramming" drug or therapy but, from my point of view, that's exactly what you ARE implicating and should as fucking around with that stuff, if you believe we were in any way and at any time subject to intelligent design (no matter how far back) is begging to get it in the ass both here and in the afterlife.

The difference between "kill" and "murder" is that murder, as a subset of kill, is undeserved by the deceased.
Eleua 21k posts, incept 2007-07-05
2023-01-19 13:43:41


Asking for a religious exemption means you're asking permission to have faith.

You are a slave at that point.

But you do you.

Point of order...

A religious exemption, if done properly and according to the law, is not a request, but an assertion.

You assert your exemption, and then that puts the state/employer in the realm of "strict scrutiny." They must prove three things, all of which are a very high bar. Should they fail to prove all three to the legal standard (again, VERY HIGH bar), and your assertion met its two prongs (very low bar), they are then open to legal action, which could prove ruinous, depending on the legal environment.

My exemption was written with 5 points. The two I had to establish and how the employer cannot meet any of the three, much less all, of the criteria for "strict scrutiny" under the various federal labor laws.

Not once did I mention anything related to stem cells or abortion.

Bottom line: it was every man for himself. The only hope we have is that some organized resistance is borne out of the chaos and destruction we all tried, with varying degrees of success, to sidestep.

See my tagline for what I have in mind.

Diversity + proximity = WAR

-They wanted camps; I want ropes.
Jackamok 177 posts, incept 2021-09-03
2023-01-19 13:43:59

When I read what you wrote, my thoughts are that maybe it was a blessing in disguise. Does anyone really want to only find out how unreliable their "allies" are AFTER the $it hits the fan?

Yep, that's a very good point. Plus this whole experience has been, shall we say, instructive. Here I was thinking I was pretty skeptical about the average person's ability to make important decisions before COVID came along, and it turns out I was actually wildly optimistic on the subject.
Jackamok 177 posts, incept 2021-09-03
2023-01-19 13:44:03

the only HONEST exemption on religious grounds would be to state that all of the existing and approved jabs work through genetic tampering...

That would have been more or less what my religious exemption would have said if I ever had to file one. Also would have said submitting to a compulsory medical procedure I did not want was against my religious beliefs. Both of those statements are 100% true for me too.

Asking for a religious exemption means you're asking permission to have faith.

You have that completely backwards. It's not asking for a religious exemption, it's stating one, backed up by the implied threat "and I can sue you for religious discrimination if you ignore this statement now that I have put you on notice."

Jackamok 177 posts, incept 2021-09-03
2023-01-19 13:44:19

Good luck, justincase, hang in there.

I don't have much to add to what other's have already said, except to say there's some evidence ketogentic diets are beneficial in fighting off some cancers.
Grf 1k posts, incept 2008-12-08
2023-01-19 13:44:24

For those that say "the right doesn't organize", I present a nationwide decentralized cell-like organization that has been doing good work: People's Rights:

Basically, a phone tree where if someone in the cell is getting hassled/arrested for exercising their rights, texts go out and 100 people show up with with guns and cameras. In my county they have made the county health department back down several times.

There is no national level leadership to co-opt or infiltrate, all cells are local at the county level, so each county would have to be taken down one at a time with infiltrators/provocateurs. It is easy to join but they have procedures and tactics manuals for rooting out / isolating provocateurs and infiltrators. They have weekly radio nets to practice for when the internet is taken offline.

"Every time we on TF talk about God and gays, God frees a banker and gives him a bonus." --me
"Your farts are interstate commerce and if they want to stick a muffler up your ass they will do it." --B
Shadowmask 4k posts, incept 2021-05-24
2023-01-19 14:45:35

Who but a slave would answer ANY of these personal questions when BEGGING for a religious exemption? This is from


Please provide any additional information that you think may be helpful in reviewing your request. For example:
-How long you have held the religious belief underlying your objection?
-Whether your religious objection is to the use of all vaccines, COVID-19 vaccines, a specific type of COVID-19 vaccine, or some other subset of vaccines.
-Whether you have received vaccines as an adult against any other diseases (such as a flu vaccine or a tetanus

Those are gotcha questions designed to auto reject. Answering any of them means you ceded your RIGHTS to their whims. Anyone who filled out that form likes getting fucked up the ass without lube.

Be like @eleua, assert! Investing in hemp isn't a bad move either...

Sportsball Team A: 3 Sportsball Team B: 3
Clot Shot: 0
Tickerguy 192k posts, incept 2007-06-26
2023-01-19 14:56:00


But -- this is inherently a weak argument if your concern is actual damage from the spike, and NOT whether genetic tampering in the general sense at a cellular level is forbidden due to your belief in intelligent design.


Novavax, for one, which at the time wasn't available but now is, and does not implicate that process. I believe the Sinopharm jab is also a protein-based jab and thus also does not implicate same (but not available in the US.)

An expedient claim not based in the actual objection may "work" but it leaves you open to severe damage or even death when the worm turns, and it always may since you can't predict the future.

If you assert it down the road you MUST expect that to be used against you IF IT CAN. And in this case -- it CAN.

The difference between "kill" and "murder" is that murder, as a subset of kill, is undeserved by the deceased.

Forever_young 76 posts, incept 2022-11-22
2023-01-19 14:58:44

FWIW, my exemption went beyond abortion and spoke of this body being a gift that I'm responsible for. I stopped it there because I'm sure they'd like nothing more than more details to come at me from a medical/philosophical point which this exemption is not. If there's one thing I've learned about government it's only give them what they ask, nothing more.

I'm not an evangelist so don't expect anything earth-shattering from me, but I do enjoy the discussion. Definitely some things to think about from all of you so I appreciate it.
Tickerguy 192k posts, incept 2007-06-26
2023-01-19 15:00:37

Yep @Forever_young -- and that's exactly the problem. The cleanest argument is simply "My body is a temple and I am its caretaker, I acknowledge that all sin however an act of intentional sin is both forbidden and serious, and thus under my religious beliefs and Constitution of the United States I am entitled to decline to do so."

The difference between "kill" and "murder" is that murder, as a subset of kill, is undeserved by the deceased.
Mjeff87 1k posts, incept 2021-11-22
2023-01-19 15:19:23


If there's one thing I've learned about government it's only give them what they ask, nothing more.

Truer words have never been spoken.

Si Vis Pacem, para Bellum

If you look like shit, then you are shit.
Tritumi 1k posts, incept 2008-11-29
2023-01-19 18:29:54

Here is a skein of logic.

Given: The necessity of a Control Group in any experimental scenario is an unquestionable principle of science.

As those running the experiment destroyed the Control Group, they violated scientific values.

Refusing the jobs is the not simply selfish individualism. Joining the Control Group is the responsible re-establishment of Science. We protect scientific principles to protect society.

Those who refuse the jab act in solidarity to ensure the survival of the collective.
Forever_young 76 posts, incept 2022-11-22
2023-01-19 20:26:24


I very much wanted to go the (actual) scientific route with my exemption but they said you couldn't. I would have loved the debate but I wasn't going to throw away the exemption with those dumbasses saying it wasn't religious. Whatever.


Chilzany 151 posts, incept 2021-09-16
2023-01-19 21:37:42

@tritumi, one of my tiny circle of pureblood friends actually tells people she's part of the control group. She loves watches people's brains melt that lack understanding of the scientific method.

I keep looking for opportunities to use that line, haven't had a chance yet myself.
Margbp 138 posts, incept 2021-12-02
2023-01-19 21:46:13

"My body is a temple and I am its caretaker..."

During the last 3 years I've been moving towards that view.

One of the reasons my daughter quit wearing a mask was a similar thought...she is made in the image & likeness of God and thus came to believe she couldn't cover that....though I doubt many would be sympathetic to that as a religious exemption. And she worked at a Christian business!

It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his desires depend upon his not understanding it.
~Upton Sinclair slightly paraphrased
Dunhamg 3 posts, incept 2021-09-19
2023-01-19 22:45:23

I feel pretty fortunate that my parents and five of my six siblings and their spouses are all on the same page with my wife and I, as well as a fair amount of my extended family. Definitely enjoy reading on this site all of the other people who were able to withstand the immense pressure and resist the past couple of years. I went and got my CDL as a possible option if I got fired for refusing the jab. One of the more interesting meetings we had during that time was an online presentation by one of our corporate doctors for the engineering group, there was a open question section where you could post anonymously and the overwhelming majority of the questions were very opposed to the jab and the mandates. That was the last time they allowed questions that way and they were moderated every time after that.
Tritumi 1k posts, incept 2008-11-29
2023-01-20 07:17:56

in case some missed my control group post in different thread...

Fumei 3k posts, incept 2019-01-08
2023-01-20 07:18:06

If a man has a right to choose his own religion, and thus take on its commandments of him, does that mean that he is only legally allowed to make such a choice once in his life?
Cmoledor 1k posts, incept 2021-04-13
2023-01-20 07:18:12

Regarding masks and the image of God. Thats exactly how I saw it. Mind you Ive done bad shit shit to my body, as a sinful nature of man, that happens. My complete fault and I will pay for that. But. Its funny how deeply I protested the fucking mask. Apart from they dont work, the thought of covering the images we were made in just drove me fucking bat shit crazy. And Im not a righteous man, but that just seemed sooooo evil to me. Eeewww. Never mask.

The whole world is one big fucking scam
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