Here Comes The Stupid: Senate Health Care Proposal
The Market Ticker - Commentary on The Capital Markets
2017-06-22 09:39 by Karl Denninger
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Here Comes The Stupid: Senate Health Care Proposal
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From the AP:

When U.S. Senate Republicans unveil their plan to overhaul America's healthcare system, they will face a skeptical public that already does not buy the justification for an earlier version that passed the House of Representatives, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll released on Wednesday.

They're right to be "skeptical"; Obamacare did exactly nothing to address cost, which is where the real issue resides, and the House bill, as I analyzed, would actually make it worse (which is hard to believe, but true.)

The Senate "attempt" will do the same.

The problem is not "insurance" or "coverage" -- it's cost.

Then there's this sort of nonsense, which IMHO argues for locking up doctors en-masse as drug pushers:

Nearly one in four people on Medicaid, the U.S. health program for the poor, received powerful and addictive opioid pain medicines in 2015, according to research by a drug-benefits management firm.

One person in four?

Folks, these drugs are responsible for some 20,000 deaths due to overdoses a year which wildly outranks other means of accidental death, save one: car accidents (~35,000)

There is only one way to address health care cost: Attack the monopolist practices of the industry and you need no new laws to do it, since we have a 100+ year old body of said law which, I remind you again, drug and medical firms have tried to shoot down twice at the US Supreme Court (in the 1970s timeframe) and they lost both times.

It requires only an executive either at the state or federal level, which again I remind you has responsibility for enforcing the law, to stand up and do their ******ned job, leveling indictments against everyone involved in this industry that attempts to promote monopolies or restrain trade.

That's all it will take and the entirety of the health scam will collapse in an afternoon, crashing prices by 80% or more.

You can look right here for what this would mean, and what it would do.

You will note that there is not one hint of any of this in the House proposal, and there won't be in the Senate version either.  Nor has my phone rang despite the fact that I've been to the Hill in the past and spoken with Senate staffers on exactly this point; they know damn well what's coming, why, and how to stop it.

The US Congress and President Trump are both engaged in intentionally destroying your health and bankrupting you at the same time.  These people need to be run out of town on a rail -- all of them -- and if you cheer on either political party or any of the existing political class at either state or federal level who have all refused to enforce existing law and solve this problem you are a direct contributor to and promoter of the destruction of this nation and her people.

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User Info Here Comes The Stupid: Senate Health Care Proposal in forum [Market-Ticker]
Exppi
Posts: 58
Incept: 2013-10-15

PDX
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The stupidity I have seen over the last few days is insane. The conflation of insurance with Medicaid and pre-existing makes me want to pull my hair out. I now know the brief stint I did at teaching college statistics was pointless. smiley

Public health folks I know appear to be living in a fantasy land where money is infinite because of debt. They are going to get a rude awakening when it blows.
Aztrader
Posts: 7796
Incept: 2007-09-10

Scottsdale, AZ
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Medicaid covers too much for people that don't contribute. I was given opiates after my surgeries and immediately after the 4th one, I refused to take them. The nurses told me that every patient begs for their oxy as soon as they can get it. The stuff really messes with your system and I didn't want the side effects to keep me down. The people in this country have become weak and these drugs keep them placated until their next hit and the taxpayers are supposed to be responsible?
Keenan
Posts: 249
Incept: 2013-01-11

Western PA
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Trump sounds ever more like the typical DC swamp monsters he railed against in his campaign: Trump said whatever Republican health reform passes, it will be a "phenomenal bill" that's "generous, kind, with heart."

"And that may be adding additional money into it," he continued. "We will come out with a real bill, not Obamacare."

The president didn't elaborate on his remark about adding funding to the GOP's health plan, but it could be geared toward the iffy prospects the AHCA is expected to face in the Senate -- where Republicans hold a four-seat advantage over Democrats and GOP support for the bill is less certain.


http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2017/06/1....

Rather than addressing the problem of cost throw more money at it. Disgusting ... no, Revolting !




Tickerguy
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We're way past the point where we should find things revolting and maybe be revolting

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Winding it down.
Mannfm11
Posts: 5379
Incept: 2009-02-28

DFW, Tx
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I have been trying to push the anti trust idea on Twitter. The biggest swamp in DC Is health care. The hospital business has every Rep and Senator under their thumb. I doubt Trump has a clue, since he probably never worried about cost.

The Federal Government is spending $30k per private job in the country. Get your mind around that. An individual has to make around $100k a year to pay that kind of tax in payroll taxes. A household around $175k. That includes Social Security. That would be for 2 jobs. A study a few years ago showed half the jobs paid $30k or less. That isn't mathematically possible. All taxes are paid by people that work for a living, either through payroll or through taxes, direct and indirect on what they consume. Long run, this can only be sustainable through draining capital, which is what deficit spending is. Federal spending should be no more than half what it is.

From what I have witnessed, the United States is going to have to break up to survive. The Capitol has totally bought into the idea of bottomless pit spending. The swamp is an organized crime syndicate, designed to make the masses poor and enrich a few. Working 9 years of one's life to be able to die in the care of a racketeering hospital makes little sense. The stat about painkillers makes a point. It is greater than the rate of gun deaths. This is what we get for 20% of our working lives? This is akin to paying and standing in line to screw a syphilis infected ***** with no drugs to cure the disease.

Fixing hospitals and the drug business would go a long way toward fixing this mess. Having a payer between the customer and vendors has allowed this to occur. The insurance system has become too expensive for the rest of the economy to afford. The majority of illnesses of people under age 50 are $15k events or less. I suspect drugs dispensed by doctors create chronic illnesses more than they cure them. Life expectancy for the broad population is no longer increasing. What they are doing isn't working, but instead seems to be nothing but a planned money drain on the US economy and its people. The swamp centers around the government and the businesses in which it is involved. None larger than health. Socialized medicine will be rationed, amounting to no care at all and will be a bitter pill to swallow, when it comes.

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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
Mannfm11
Posts: 5379
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DFW, Tx
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Az, pain pills make me angry after a day or so. I usually take them for a day and then ration them, keeping them on hand for night.

Ditto on the swamp and Trump. I don't understand why the Democrats don't get on board? Trump looks like Nixon in his politics. Nixon gave the Democrats about everything they wanted. DC is too deep in stealing to make compromises. Only for double donors don't have a horse in the race. They have the winning ticket

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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
Flyingillini
Posts: 108
Incept: 2009-06-09

Reno, NV
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They refuse to fix the problem simply because of the campaign bribes from the perps ?
Tickerguy
Posts: 149204
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Quote:
They refuse to fix the problem simply because of the campaign bribes from the perps ?

Well, that's part of it.

The other part is more insidious -- if you fix it then health care collapses back to ~4% of the economy. This results in a huge number of layoffs of parasitic "employees" (who never provide one second of care to a person in their entire career) and a short-term, but very severe, contraction in GDP.

Who wants credit for a reported economic Depression, no matter how short-lived?

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Winding it down.
Jfms99
Posts: 199
Incept: 2009-10-06

Msumelle, Ar
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While Trump should breakup the monopolies it will not happen. The main reason is that Trump does not want to confront the Recession that would happen by doing so.

The problem is that the people out there like many aspects of Obamacare and no one wants to confront the cost involved or the consequences.

If we had an honest media that would cover these issues truthfully then maybe public support could be built up to go in a different direction. But that is not going to happen. The MSM will just spin things the way they want even as the Titanic sinks.

The latest health bill and the bullet points I read from the Senate is another bad piece of legislation and these people are just tone deaf to the reality.

Might as well get ready for Reckoning, it's coming. If Illinois folds the Federal Government can't bail them out, if they do they open the door to how many other states? We,as, a country are broke now. We can't bail out all of the bad decisions made at the state level. California would be the real nightmare bail out.

No we just have to prepare be ready, the Democrats have succeeded in selling the Idea that Health Care is Right, not an option. The financial train wreck cannot be stopped at this point.

Oldno7
Posts: 2581
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RECALL STATE USA
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Well I got another message from the Trump gang to join their ranks and donate a dollar or more but what I sent them is Karl's Fix to Health Care. I know it's like pissing into the wind but who knows?

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IT'S THE SPENDING STUPID The US must become less a government of men, and more a government of LAW.When people lose everything and have nothing left to lose they lose it -Gerald Celente
Tdurden
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So I'm guessing that the new, improved and larger penalty for refusing the do business with their campaign contributors is alive and well in this one, too?

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"I'd like to live just long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next 10 generations that some favors come with too high of a price." -Vir Cotto Babylon 5
Svtikicat
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"Nearly one in four people on Medicaid, the U.S. health program for the poor, received powerful and addictive opioid pain medicines..." and "... these drugs are responsible for some 20,000 deaths due to overdoses a year".

Maybe that's the plan?

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SAD FACT: Misinformed people rarely change their minds when presented with the truth.
Tickerguy
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The ****ers in the medical profession that write those scripts need to be charged with homicide exactly as they charge drug dealers that sell some junkie the drug that kills them.

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Winding it down.
Svtikicat
Posts: 8
Incept: 2017-05-24

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On a side note, I once read a simultaneously silly and profound idiom regarding getting rich: "Stop doing the things that make you poor".

The same thing applies to healthcare. Once I realized that my doctor was not going to really help me and only relieve symptoms, I went LCHFMP, lost 80lbs, returned my blood pressure to normal, and was able to stop all but one of the many drugs they had prescribed.

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SAD FACT: Misinformed people rarely change their minds when presented with the truth.
Eli
Posts: 8523
Incept: 2007-09-10

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Now that the health care bill is out are you going to attempt you were wrong Karl?

I mean you clearly miscalculated how ****ty this thing would be.


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If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever.
George Orwell

Tickerguy
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You're right -- it's even more-****ty..... smiley

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Winding it down.
Mannfm11
Posts: 5379
Incept: 2009-02-28

DFW, Tx
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I don't think the GDP has much to do with it. Competition would get us there over time, not immediately. The main problem is bureaucrats, who are supposed to be brought in to solve problems, but instead invent them and make certain they become worse rather than better. This is the case, wherever government pokes their nose. One need only look at health and education to see the mess, at ever increasing costs they create. No problem, no job for them and their fellows. This is the real reason universities have become so leftist.

Sad to say, the price of everything depends on constantly increasing debt and credit. The swamp lives on inflation, the very thing that devastates the real private sector. Health care is merely another blood draining financial sector. These excesses create the imbalance in trade. What for? To keep money flowing through the multinationals. Do we really expect the rest of the world to pay us to shuffle paper?

I don't believe we would ever get to 4% of GDP, but a move back to 10% would free up $2 trillion for the rest of the economy. Remember medicine is like military bases, which used to be used to rule Congress. Every congressional district in the US has a hospital. The politicians can't have this group against them. Higher costs feed both sides the provider and users. Think of the number of people who have really never paid a real health bill? The only peeps who see them are not insured. We have no idea what the real price is, because no one ever sees a real number on a bill.

I hate to get into conspiracies, but this one was set up a long time ago. Literally everything done in health care has been to make it less competitive, I don't see much evidence it has been better now than years ago my grandparents all lived into their 80's with little health care. That is 4 out of 4. I had 2 great grandfather's live past 84. Of my parents, aunts and uncles, only 2 out of 8 made 83. I'm certain that today, medicine would have claimed responsibility for the former generations longevity, but I suspect they would have made little difference, except in the size of their estate.

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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
Wa9jml
Posts: 12
Incept: 2017-04-29

DeKalb, Illinois
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I think that many people support government medicine thinking that it will be not only free of cost for them, but that they will wind up in the part of the boondoggle that is actually funded. As the economist Yuri Maltsev once told me, any socialist medical program will always have two tiers. In HillaryCare, the funded tier would have been the Postal Service Program, where she and her fellow nomenklatura would all be placed. He worked in some lower tier hospitals to put himself through school, and his stories about the level of care in those were pretty gruesome.

Rand Paul rightly characterizes "free medical care" as enslaving doctors and their staffs. As I recall, when Belgium put in socialized medicine, they threatened to draft the physicians into their army and severely punish those who refused to work in that system.

I agree that enforcing existing anti-trust laws are the only effective way to deal with this mess. But, in the interim, I would like to see the truly indigent be declared Veterans of the War on Poverty, and placed into the already existing VA medical system. This would be convenient for them since most VA hospitals seem to be close to their neighborhoods. Then, they can get good training waiting for appointments, dealing with an obnoxious bureaucracy inflamed by Affirmative Action, and have bad experiences with surgeries. It will be a paradise just like the British Health System! We can then put retired university professors, their families, and other leftists in the same system. I'm sure that they will be very happy with the resulting care...
Als
Posts: 523
Incept: 2010-03-12

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I read something last week that said 93% of the jobs since the early 2000's were due to the birth death model. Someone died or retired causing a job opening and instantly a job was created according to the Government.

It's all about the money nothing more. We go to a truly free market medical care system like Karl has talked about, those $200K plus PCP positions are going to turn into $125K jobs. There is going to be a lot less administrative personnel roaming the halls of the hospitals in this country.

Don't get me started on the Opioid problem I've been following a Indy Journalist on YouTube who's been railing on the pain med problem for days. He ended up in an Ohio jail last weekend on trumped up charges and the FBI is going to get hit with multi Million dollar lawsuit over it. He found out they've had him under surveillance for sometime because he's been stepping on some very powerful toes. He learned about the surveillance on him by talking to local police after his arrest. As soon as he got into town to talk to a couple of sources, the FBI informed the local police to find him and pick him up. The local police couldn't have been nicer to him during his stay with them. The FBI did send someone down from a local office to talk to him and he said he got the feeling the Agent really had no idea why they were there.

While he spent a day in a local jail he saw the young adults that were being dragged into the cells all around him for opioid possession and use. He said it was heart breaking seeing these young kids lives being destroyed by this epidemic.

One scandal of four or five he's been investigating involves high ranking Government officials and the VA. It is on the use of 1/4 and 1/2 strength pain meds being purchased through Pakistan and sold to the VA as full strength medication. So you're a vet and they give you a prescription at the VA for 325mg Percocet but in reality when the VA fills it you're getting a 165mg or even an 80mg tablet. Oh it says 325mg on the tablet but it's not. We're talking major money is being made by crooked Government Officials including our elected representatives off our Veterans.

He said the other day that Ohio has just brought suit this week on several Pharmaceutical companies for their responsibility in promoting this Opioid problem across the country.
Eli
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Als would you mind sharing a link?

The opioid epidemic is the poster child for our whole healthcare system, it is all about creating repeat customers. Back pain? bad knees let me give you a script for 60 Norco 10mg see you next month!

God they love people with type 2 diabetes Doctors can control it by throwing a handful of pills at, and by control it I mean if you don't change your diet and loose weight you are still totally ****ed.

This thing is teetering and about to come down, these poor ****s that are hooked on the healthcare scam are going to ****ing die, and quick.

We don't have healthcare we have Extortion care, it is run by mobsters that have the judges and politicians in their pockets.

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If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever.
George Orwell

Bodhi
Posts: 106
Incept: 2008-02-23

Georgia
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Quote:
Medicaid covers too much for people that don't contribute. I was given opiates after my surgeries and immediately after the 4th one, I refused to take them. The nurses told me that every patient begs for their oxy as soon as they can get it. The stuff really messes with your system and I didn't want the side effects to keep me down. The people in this country have become weak and these drugs keep them placated until their next hit and the taxpayers are supposed to be responsible?


Several years ago I went to the emergency room with sharp pain on the right side of my chest. It was diagnosed as pleurisy. I was given an anti-inflammatory shot and was also given a prescription for the pill form. I read the info sheet the pharmacist gave me and noticed that one of the possible side effects was death. I thought, "Side effect? That sounds rather permanent." I only took the pills for 1 1/2 days and disposed of the rest. I'd rather feel the pain than voluntarily expedite my journey to whatever comes next.
Krzelune
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Incept: 2007-10-08

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When I was in Australia years ago you could buy codeine over the counter and they had no opioid epidemic then. Now I see they are banning it over the counter. Makes me wonder what has changed with people.
Goforbroke
Posts: 6981
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Als ... I live in Ohio and am more than familiar with the drug problem here ... do you have a link for the lawsuit you mentioned? Thanks.

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Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our Light, and not our Darkness, that most frightens us. -- Marianne Williamson
Tsherry
Posts: 852
Incept: 2008-12-09

Spokane WA
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Sorry guys and gals, but nothing is going to get fixed.

We all have some pretty sweet seats though in the passenger lounge of the Hindenburg, and we're just over the Jersey shore.

Should be a nice, smooth docking, right?

Tom
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