63k ?!?!?!?

That's just asinine...outrageous...highway robbery...scammery...

especially when most degrees at Drexel require 5 years to complete if you're in the work/study program. 300k+ for a frikkin' degree ?????

I think a degree from Drexel allows you to work at Dominos?

"I'm done. You want to keep screwing our kids, I say "NO." You keep this crap up my answer is that I will make a maximum effort to see your so-called "universities" DESTROYED.

De-funded, de-certified, your degrees treated as toilet paper and your graduate's resumes shredded on sight."

Sorry to say but, just like me, you are a mosquito on the posterior of an elephant (and donkey). Keep your blood pressure lower by learning to laugh at that which you cannot possibly stop.

Fraud and corruption start at the top.

Get help paying for college
Submit a Free Application for Federal Student Aid (FAFSA)
http://www.fafsa.ed.gov/

Quote:

Sorry to say but, just like me, you are a mosquito on the posterior of an elephant (and donkey). Keep your blood pressure lower by learning to laugh at that which you cannot possibly stop.

Bull****!!

If your not yelling nobody can hear you.

My my money is on Karl I think he can make a difference.


FTC Enacts Mortgage Advertising Rules
Posted on 22nd Jul 2011 @ 8:04 AM

The Federal Trade Commission (FTC) issued a new “Mortgage Acts and Practices — Advertising Rule” on July 19. The new rule, which was issued in response to the Omnibus Appropriations Act of 2009, as clarified by the Credit CARD Act of 2009, bans deceptive mortgage advertising practices.

The new rule lists 19 examples of prohibited deceptive claims, including misrepresentations about:

The existence, nature, or amount of fees or costs to the consumer associated with the mortgage;
The terms, amounts, payments, or other requirements relating to taxes or insurance associated with the mortgage;
The variability of interest, payments, or other terms of the mortgage;
The type of mortgage offered;
The source of an advertisement or other commercial communication; and
The consumer’s ability or likelihood of obtaining a refinancing or modification of a mortgage or any of its terms.
The rule applies to all entities within the FTC’s jurisdiction that advertise mortgages — mortgage lenders, brokers, and servicers; real estate agents and brokers; advertising agencies; home builders; lead generators; rate aggregators; and others. Although the rule does not cover banks, thrifts, or federal credit unions, it does cover entities that are affiliated with banks, such as parent or subsidiary companies. The FTC also has jurisdiction over non-bank entities that provide services to or on behalf of a bank.

Section 5 of the FTC Act generally prohibits advertisers from making false or misleading claims. The new MAP Rule parallels the Section 5 prohibition and will allow the FTC to seek appropriate relief (including civil penalties) against those who engage in deceptive mortgage advertising.

The Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (CFPB) and state law enforcement authorities also may bring actions to enforce the MAP Rule. On July 21, 2011, the Commission’s rulemaking authority for the rule transfers to the CFPB, but the FTC, the CFPB, and the states all will have authority to enforce the rule.

The using the word generally is a joke

I keep telling kids that come into the library and are willing to listen to me about this crap all the time.

Now you see why my kids are going to junior college/trade school and then a state school (although here in CA it is getting tougher). Oh well, they will have to help by working through and maybe taking that 6 year route with some transfer credits.

Bottom line, you have to be a savvy shopper unless Gates or Buffet is your last name. On top of that you have to realize that people will have to think outside the traditional box if they want to graduate with very little (<5K debt) or no debt period.

KD, don't worry this bubble, when it collapses, is gonna make the housing bubble look like a day at Disneyworld by comparison because it will take down banks, borrowers, taxpayers, colleges/universities, and a chunk of the goobermint, think Dept. of Ed., as well as our future (kids) connedsumers. Who will buy these overpriced McMansions when I have 200K in student loans to payoff?

This cannot go on much longer.

"If your not yelling nobody can hear you."

Nobody "hears you" either unless you have a few million to buy a voice. The propagandized, ignorant general population will simply think your revolt is rather nutty and the mainstream media will not cover it. So stop damaging your arterial walls and just do the best you _ethically_ can within a system that will only change via its self-destruction (pending).

Anyway, have fun, it's National Physics Day!

http://www.aps.org/publications/apsnews/....

So, please watch the Bernanke Dust Bunny episode of the original Outer Limits:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23tfAkly0....

Har!

Funny story - my daughter is a HS Junior so of course we're on the college tour circuit. Thing is, she's interested in something that's considered a specialty (culinary) and wants to stay "close" so the sample of schools is small - smaller once we get down to what we can afford.

The deal we've made with her all along is that we would be willing to pay for a state school (or equivalent) so long as she held-up her end of the deal (won't go into that here as that's between us) and she's completely cool with that. Having read KD's earlier tickers on the subject she's completely allergic to the idea of student loans - so thanks for that, Karl!

Just for grins I ran my numbers through one of the FAFSA calculators - my Expected Family Contribution is roughly the tuition/fees/room/board for Johnson and Wales (which WAS on her list until she saw the price tag) - just south of $40K. To put that in perspective, that's about 40% more than I pay in mortgage, taxes and condo fee combined - or put another way that's about 1/3 of my annual after tax income. And that's my expected contribution to my daughter's education. Seriously.

Oh wait, it gets better. Because of this craptacular state in which I live (People's Republic of MA) it's actually cheaper to send my daughter across the border to pay out of state at SUNY than to send her into the ZooMass system. Yep - my tax dollars hard at work, there.

Uh, did I say this was a funny story? Then why do I feel like punching something?

As a Papist I'm really not supposed to wish ill upon these college administrators - like they should all die in a fire. But I will however note than while these colleges and virtually all who work there (especially the faculty and administrators) seem to be enthusiastic supporters of Marxism and Socialism they sure seem to equally enthusiastically embrace Capitalism when it comes to their bread and butter, no?

Docj wrote..

my Expected Family Contribution... about 1/3 of my annual after tax income. And that's my expected contribution to my daughter's education. Seriously.

Been there. Colleges are absolutely high if they think families can pay what they deem to be the 'Expected Family Contribution.' And that's IN ADDITION TO the loans colleges expect both parents and students to take out each year (as noted in Karl's ticker).

We have 2 in college. The total cost to us each year is significantly higher than the average annual salary in the U.S. And they're both in state schools, not pricey privates.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/23/politics/c....

And both Romney and Obama support extending the low loan rates.

They obviously cannot see that making college more "affordable" really only helps to continue cycle of annual tuition increases.

I say let rates double or even triple. That would force colleges to *lower* tuition.

But I know KD has talked a blue streak about this.

Karl - anything you start doing on this, count me in. My daughter is entering 9th grade next year and I am already receiving e-mail from the high school informing of how important a college education is and that I need to start prepping for all the paper work. They want me to begin collecting all my data and coming to "work shops" at the high school set up by college board approved (what ever that means) people who can help in financial aid seminars.

It's all a bunch of lies, crap and bull****.

@Docj

I too live in The Peoples Republic, take a look at what YOU/WE pay for:

http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/wfxt/pdf/....

I personally know two of the people on that list, one was a Spanish teacher (Hernandez), and the other the ex-Colonel of the MA State Police (Robbins). Fine people, but we were paying a Spanish teacher over $100k a year!

The best part? It's Legislated that the retirement systems ROI is 8.25%, guess who pays the shortfall? Employees contribute nowhere near what they get in return for Pension Salary (80%), Medical and "Other Post-Employment Benefits".

http://www.mapension.com/publications/

Oh look, the Actual Performance on the fund was 3.43%.

So yes, KD has it right, it is organized, but who & how can you fix a system when the very beneficiaries are in charge of said system? Vote? Right. With less than 50% voter turnout, the "friends, family & beneficiaries" of such fraud ensure it to continue. Colleges, especially State schools for purposes of this thread, have ZERO risk, and YOU/I pay for it!

It's legal larceny

I also live in the Commonwealth, and a buddy and I pulled Millis' teachers salary records for 2004-ish. 50K median income in a town whose residents barely made that. Don't give me that bull**** about working long hours. So do I. What I don't get is 3 months vacation every year.

It will collapse when the money runs out. It always does. Unfortunately, the whole country will go down the ****ter.

Heh, Curb - you should go to one of those "workshops"...and loudly ask them the total cost of the education with all the loans, expected time to payoff, salary necessary for said child to "earn" back the layout, career that is currently paying that salary that isn't being outsourced, comparison to plumber wages, etc etc.

Make them squirm, and demand answers. Expose the bull**** - that's one small way to impede the debt-pushers.

It took my parents 2.5 years to figure out why I backed out of helping my brother financially through college (graduates in 3 weeks). Didn't mind helping, but I make the rules if I supply the cash, and he wasn't having any of that. I don't think he's coming out with much debt ($9k?), but the worst part was watching the 4-year drain on my parents, and having to turn them down when they personally asked me for assistance. They are only going to learn to not make silly financial decisions by not supporting said bad decisions. (And now he asks for a new car!) People say it's having a "big heart" ... I say it's stupidity.

I'm dating a woman whose son graduated from a state college with a degree in Philosophy and $1,000/mth in student loans.

This kid gets regular handouts from mom and dad and mom gave him her (pretty new) car too. This woman is very attractive for her age and just likes to have fun and dance and ****. That's why I 'date' her.

PS. We both have the same life philosophy and the same likes and the same politics so we get along well. Did I mention that she is hot too? Yea I think I did but it bears repeating.

Sean: You're snipped, right?

Sean, either ^ or make sure that she is snipped. If she says she is, make her show you the scar(s). They are tiny but should be there.

Flap

"My daughter is a HS Junior so of course we're on the college tour circuit. Thing is, she's interested in something that's considered a specialty (culinary) and wants to stay 'close' so the sample of schools is small - smaller once we get down to what we can afford."

My architecture firm is working with a small Kentucky county that is constructing a culinary arts classroom in their high school, complete with commercial kitchen.

They have subdivided their 10-12 grade student body into various academies towards graduating kids with either marketable skills, partial college credits or both. Within one of those academies is culinary arts. Working with restaurants and related companies in the area they can produce high school graduates to exactly fill the need for regional employment, so must limit the number of students based on workforce demand (which is still over 100 students).

The programs for these classes are drafted by regional community colleges. I can see a day when, after normal school hours, older students can pay modest fees to take college-level courses, for real credit, at the county high school, for which the school system gets income.

I don't think I'll ever accept the fact that one has to go to college to learn to cook. Restauranteur, maybe, for the business side.

Spot-on, Nash. Frankly if I knew this was where she was headed last year I'd have pushed for her to go to the local Vo-Tech high school for her last 2-years of HS to learn how to cook. That ship has sailed however as it's too late to transfer in now. Oh well.

I know her long-term goal is to have her own pastry shop, so the business side of what she'll get if she sticks around for the 3rd and 4th years to get her BBA (she'll have her AAS after 2-years) will certainly help with that. We'll see.

Tell her to **** college and go into enslavement at a local bakery.

She's 54 and post-menopausal guys so no problem there. We seem to have a good realtionship. It actually is more than just sex.

http://www.jamesaltucher.com/2012/04/new....

I often disagree with Altucher on many things, but at least this is something to think about.

Quote:

So please help me save lives. Students think they will have fun, think they will be independent, think they will get a job that will make their lives better. So they go to college.

They do this because they think their lives will miss something if they don’t. They will miss all sorts of valuable discourse, intellectual elevation, socializing unheard of before in their high school years, and ultimately the American dream of job, spouse, house, white picket fence, grow old, get a gold watch, die.

They have been brainwashed into thinking they will be worthless without college. How sad for them. How sad for their parents.



But they are wrong. They are only 18. They are babies. How can they know with such surety that this is THE ONLY way they can achieve their goals? Maybe there are better ways. Maybe there are 40 better ways. Or more!

I don’t want you to think I strung together blog posts. I didn’t. I present my reasons very clearly why kids should not go to college. I do this after receiving thousands of hate mails on this topic and knowing what people’s touch points are.

And I separately go over why parents should not sent their kids to college. I go over the true costs of what college costs, including the opportunity cost.

I answer the questions people have been constantly asking me like, “Won’t they get a better job?” Or “You went to college so how can you tell people not to?” Would someone also say that to a murderer?


(dropped out of high school to pursue his dream of becoming a successful actor)
And finally, I borrow from my post “8 Alternatives to College”, expand those eight and wrote 32 more to come up with “40 Alternatives to College”.

I do this with all sincerity. I priced the book as little as I could (99 cents) and it’s even free for Amazon Prime members. Any meager money I make on this will be donated to whatever foundation I can find that can keep people from going to college. Nothing in my career has anything to do with this. It did not help me in any way to spend 100s of hours getting this book ready and available to you and your children.

I am shamed by the indentured servitude that our 22 years olds find themselves in when they graduate. Student loan debt just topped a trillion dollars for the first time. I am ashamed by an America that let this happen. I describe in the book the groups who benefit from that trillion dollars. They don’t care about 18 year olds. They care about their own egos. They care about money.

Can you get a job at Goldman Sachs if you don’t go to college? Or even Google? Probably not. But there’s at least 40 alternatives and probably thousands more. And, after trying these alternatives you now have the grace and intelligence (and knowledge that you are comfortable with the massive debt load you will be taking on) then please go.


(this 18 year old ran for mayor in his town)
But I wish my father had sat me down and told me when I was 18 that I had choices in life. That life wasn’t one monochrome ladder from birth to death. He spent his last two years of life immobile on a hospital bed. College doesn’t prepare you for the suffering. And it’s very stressful along the way. It’s time to start now to live every moment to the fullest, every moment as if time itself were your canvas and your actions were the colors, the brush, the brilliant ideas.

When you’re 18 you have the chance to explore the world, to explore all of your interests, to explore yourself. You also have the chance to make a lot of money while your peers go into their debts. I’ve personally invested in companies started by 18 year olds who were making thousands of dollars in profits A DAY.


(this young man made $1.2 million instead of going to college)
This is the only time I’ve asked someone (the readers of this post) to help me sell a book. There’s nothing wrong at all with making money but I will make no money on this book and I have no fake agenda except two:

- I want to help 18 year olds see they have enormous choices in life. Choices that can be fun, creative, vastly increase their intelligence and health in ways college couldn’t, vastly increase their ability to socialize, to network, to be happy in ways that college couldn’t.

- I keep thinking about me being 18. The decisions I made. The decisions I rejected. Nobody sat me down and told me I had a choice. And even then, when college was much cheaper, I would’ve done any of these choices in a heartbeat if I had known they were acceptable in society.


(Amanda Hocking skipped college and made millions self-publishing vampire novels)
To succeed, go the other way. Don’t go the same way the herds are going. The herds are walking off a cliff, graduating with more debt than they can pay back in their lives. Trapping themselves in a world of horror and stress.

Please see the alternatives that I’ve picked out. One of them even involves taking college courses but much cheaper. One involves running for office. One involves hiking the Appalachian Trail. One of them involves mastering an art and expanding your creativity in ways you would not have time for if you also had 50 other requirements. Altogether, there’s forty alternatives. It’s 99 cents to save you (the student and the parent) from a lifetime of debt and stress.

And even for adults who have degrees – heck, these alternatives are for you also. If I did one of these alternatives for a full year, and switch, for each of the last 40 years of my life I’d die a happy man.

Know that the world does not need growth only invented by people with college degrees. In fact, the reverse is starting to happen. Innovation is being crushed out of the young indentured servants who are graduating. And creativity, new opportunities, new beginnings, are being initiated by those who constantly seek their choices and their alternatives. And not only will they benefit, but all the people with degrees will benefit, and all the humans who ride piggyback on top of innovation will benefit, and when I enjoy seeing what happens, I will benefit. Let’s all benefit together.

I grew up enslaved at a bakery. We have fresh bread now but other than that it sucked. lol