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The open question, and one that I cannot seem to find a reasonable answer to, is why we, the people, continue to allow both a Congress and Federal Reserve to sit in control of our government and financial system when they permit and endorse actions that constitute financial******of such an egregious nature that absolutely everyone can understand it.

Or why any individual still does business with BoA.

Does mark to market come back in 2011? I thought I had seen something about that. Maybe I am imagining or thinking of something different.

Closed two accounts today. My objective next week is to close out my safety deposit box and have all my accounts closed on the banking side by May 9.

Good plan. The boxes are no longer safe.

Step 1. Impose Police State/Martial Law.

Step 2. Repudiate Entitlements.

Step 3. Inflate.


...Am I missing Anything?

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...Am I missing Anything?

Confiscate wealth - starting with 401K plans.

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Or why any individual still does business with BoA.

A few months back I went into my CU to cash some old savings bonds that had matured. The teller said that the CU couldn't cash them and sent me across the parking lot to the local BoA branch. When the BoA teller found out I didn't have an account with them she suggested that I open one. "Unlike your credit union", she said with a smarmy smile, "BoA can take care of ALL your banking needs". I returned her smarmy smile and bet her the value of the savings bonds that the REASON my credit union couldn't cash them was because of banking industry lobbying efforts.

I have no idea if that is true or not, but the hostile silence that followed suggested that Marguerite with ൢ Years Experience" (so her nameplate said) didn't know either. Or she knew and I hit the nail squarely on the head.

I've been reading the ticker for about a year...and felt like a traitor walking across that BoA lobby.

The market will confiscate wealth on it's own. I read that Mutual Funds are all in on equities right now. Guessing from 401(k) investors not feeling so scared.

That is a big goose sitting in the market looking for a Christmas dinner.

As for Bank of America, looks like the Move Your Money campaign has scared a few people in the E-suite.

I've got that measly percentage beaten, hands down.

2 weeks ago I received a notice that one of my credit card companies had drafted out a payment of about $350, per previous instructions. So far, so good. The next day, I went to Chase to withdraw some cash. First, though, I decided to check my balance. It said that the particular account had about $375 in it. So I withdrew $100. Later that day, I went to the store around the corner to buy some food, and spent $67 plus asked for another $30 as a cash advance (SWMBO reminded me that we needed to pay some school-related expense for one of our rugrats). On the way out, I stopped at the Redbox and rented a movie - which we watched that night and which I returned the next morning (total cost $1.08). So, $375-100-67-30-1=177 remaining balance...or so I thought. Nope, didn't work out that way - the ****ing ATM gave me incorrect information, as the $350 hadn't yet come out. Of course, it didn't come out until midnight **after** the other 4 transactions (which I thought were actually 3 - who'd a thunk that the 67 and the 30 cash advance were 2 transactions, it was only 1 swipe of the card - the mother****ers!). But they put the largest withdrawal first, making the balance about $25. Then the 4 charges came through, largest first. 4 O/D fees of $35 each, the last of which was on a charge of $1.08.

I went to the same branch where I withdrew the money (and had opened the account last summer, because my paycheck is drawn on Chase, not because I love them so much) and reviewed it with the banker I had been dealing with for the last 9 months. He immediately refunded $70, but said that they couldn't do more without permission from higher up. The next day I received a call from him, saying that his manager had approval, but that it'd take a day or two to process. That was over 10 days ago, and I'm still waiting for that last $70 to be refunded. You'd think that I was asking them to credit my account for $7 million, the way they are processing this thing. Oh, I also covered the entire set of withdrawals and charges with a deposit on the spot.

Lesson learned: I won't bank with those ****ers again, convenience be damned - though it'll take me a few weeks to get all of the automatic withdrawals changed to a different bank. I will tell everyone I know about this. I also signed up for the option, starting on 3/29, to not allow any debits to go through if the balance would thereby be reduced to below $0...so my exposure is limited to the next 3 weeks.

But, anyhow, I kicked your 31,200% all over the place. First, the charge wasn't $5, it was $1.08, and I covered the shortfall the next day - so I beat your 218,000% by a factor of very close to 5. Probably over 1,000,000% APR. Let's just say that it is very fortunate for all involved that a) I didn't have my carry piece with me; and b) the chairman of JPMorgan Chase wasn't anywhere nearby, the sack of ****.

***2nd edit - after finishing this response, I was motivated to call Chase to see what the status was. Guess what, the ****ing bastards won't be refunding my last $70. I told the very nice guy who had opened the account exactly what I thought of his employer, and that there was no way I'd ever be a Chase customer again. Oh, special bonus: he was surprised that the bank manager had not contacted me yet - seems she found out about it yesterday and didn't have the simple decency to call me.

I am really*****ed beyond words right now. The ****ing thieves stole $70 from me. Now I HOPE AND PRAY that JPMorgan Chase loses BILLIONS on their massive short position in silver - let the bastards go broke!

Bless their hearts.

I genuinely do not understand the outrage on this issue.

It isn't a loan, and you may never pay it back.

The fact is you over drafted your account and violated the terms of service.

If I drain an account at BofA tomorrow, and then run a purchase through for a grand or ten, they have every right to screw me. Using a debit card is no different really than writing a check for an unfunded account.

You think there should be no fee charged if you drain your account and then write a bounced check to a merchant?

I fully understand the games they play, and that the charge should not go through in the first place, but why are we excusing the personal responsibility here?

Last I read, The O/D Fee income was far higher than 1.72 Billion as a composite. That may be for B of A. I'll do some research today, time permitting. O/D fees are considered hallowed grounds in banking. I had a company blow sky high on me in the 80s. There was no less than $4,000 in O/D Fees on the checking account. I offered to pay 50K cash to bring the credit line current, if they wiped the 4K in O/D fees. Not a chance.

The only person I saw who got O/D fees wiped was a friend and a former employee who is an African American who looked like William Perry of the Chicago Bears. He "asked" the bank manager to wipe the fees from his account and it was done promptly with no questions asked. Maybe a baseball bat as the stick?

Yeah, I think that's BofA only too - the total I saw last time was close to $20b annually across the system.

I'm kind of STUCK with BoA for the foreseeable future. Our mortgage was "sold" to BoA (former Countrywide), post-losing-my-job, and I have a decent interest rate. I could try to refinance, but with low cash (which is much-needed) and no job, I'm sure as **** not going to get a liar-loan to do it just to drop these ****tards. I'm still debating whether or not to just STOP paying every other mortgage until I'm out of all other debt completely.

Total Overdraft Fee Income in 2008 : 24 Billion according to this Research report
http://www.responsiblelending.org/overdr....

Warning PDF

By the way, if you ask at your local branch to "opt out " of this service , after people get over the shock, their will be a form you can fill out. This may or may not be true of all banks. They do make it difficult.

As far as people defending the use of debit card O/D fees, shame shame. Debit cards are by and large Visa and Mastercard branded products. Just like they have the ability to decline a purchase at a swipe or online for lack of credit they also have the ability to decline the same using a debit card. The fact that you can opt out, so it will in effect do this, is proof enough.

I'm not quite at the position of Blairkiel. But I agree that stating these penalties in APR terms is misleading as these are not loans but fees. They should be stated in your contract terms.

While O/D charges are within the terms of the contracts, they are definitely offensive. The appropriate response is, as has often been called for here, to boycott institutions that engage in these practices. The problem comes when behemoth banks obtain special privilege that allows them to offer better terms or service than their competitors. These are the real outrages, as market forces would have already punished such abuses if all institutions were on a level playing field.

I know some of you other guys got this call, but Capital One called me to ask my permission to allow them to charge overdraft on a credit card. They even went so far as to give me a bargain, $29.99 insteaed of $39.99. After a little bit of discussion, I asked them how much over the limit they would allow me to go because I might need to finance a heart attack. That got rid of her.

I can't get on board with this Ticker.

You willingly open a credit card. There are terms to the agreement that you agreed to. One is that they will extend you a certain amount of credit. It's disingenuous to suggest that, upon reaching that limit, that being penalized for going "only" $5 over is outrageous.

Never mind the fact that you have an individual with a maxed-out credit card buying a $5 cup of coffee with his maxed-out credit card. I think all of us can see the fundamental problem there. Let's go forward... some believe that the credit card company shouldn't be able to hit you with a $30 or whatever fee for exceeding your limit, which means their exposure to you is exceeding the limits that you agreed to. The amount is irrelevant. OK, let's ban that practice. So, what happens? Now, the card is straight-up declined. For a cup of coffee, that's no big deal. But let's say out guy isn't buying a $5 cup of coffee... he's lost his job, which is why his card is maxed out, and he's driving cross-country to a new job. His radiator goes. He gets twoed to a shop, and they say a new radiator will be $200. He hands them the card... and it's straight-up declined. Our poor guy would be more than willing to pay a $35 overdraft fee to get his radiator, but now he can't, because a whining sad-sack who bought $5 cups of coffee on credit went over and cried that it "wasn't fair" that he got charged 31,000% interest on his "honest mistake".

The Law of Unintended Consequences is a real bitch. We ignore her at our extreme peril.

It's not a credit card Jnojr, its a DEBIT card.

If I have no money in my account the debit should be DECLINED.

Credit and debit are not the same thing, and I should have the right to OPT for overdraft service at some agreed price.

There was NO OPTION AT ALL on these cards until the law change. It was not only impossible to opt out but if you pulled a balance check at an ATM many times they would intentionally display stale data so you thought you had money in the account when you did not, then they re-ordered transactions to get the maximum dick size up your *******.

Unfortunately Obama and his Administration (as well as Congress) are ALL IN with the banksters.

Here is a great read today from Yves Smith:

Yves here. The reason that people who can discern clearly what is afoot are so deeply disturbed is simple, and all the comments touch on it. The campaign to defend Geithner and Emanuel, both architects of the administration’s finance friendly policies has gone beyond what most people would see as spin into such an aggressive effort to manipulate popular perceptions that it is not a stretch to call it propaganda.

This strategy, of relying on propaganda to mask their true intent, has become inevitable, given the strategic corner the Obama Adminstration has painted itself in. And this campaign has become increasingly desperate as the inconsistency between the Adminsitration’s “product positioning” and observable reality become increasingly evident.

Everyone should read the whole post:

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2010/03/t....

You can opt out now (fifth third). The bank makes the changes on customers that may not make good on the overdraft.

The open question, and one that I cannot seem to find a reasonable answer to, is why we, the people, continue to allow both a Congress and Federal Reserve to sit in control of our government and financial system when they permit and endorse actions that constitute financial******of such an egregious nature that absolutely everyone can understand it.


The combination of the vote and the false dichotomy of the existing two-party system lets people think they are doing something when they vote existing office-holders out and choose new office holders. Thus, the electorate believes they are voting for "Hope and Change" or "Morning in America" but instead get a generally consistent set of policies with minor deviations to the left and right. Meanwhile, the voters become emotionally invested in the meaningless verbal hyperbole used by both parties. Thus, they exhaust their energy and those with a vested interest in maintaining the current trajectory win easily.

The solution lies first in recognizing the problem and next in developing a viable alternative. I perceive little recognition of the issue at present, and perceive no viable alternative at this time.

All just my opinion, which is of no value to anyone anyway.

I ordered a $72 slice of pizza from Wells Fargo last year on account of them holding the purchase for two weeks before applying it. Naturally they piggybacked after a rent check that ran the account two bucks red.

Thanks, guys.