We're Going to Have To Legally Shoot Them
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2018-07-10 07:00 by Karl Denninger
in Technology , 343 references Ignore this thread
We're Going to Have To Legally Shoot Them
[Comments enabled]

And we should start with AMD:

Chinese-designed "Dhyana" x86 processors based on AMD's Zen microarchitecture are beginning to surface from Chinese chip producer Hygon. The processors come as the fruit of AMD's x86 IP licensing agreements with its China-based partners and break the decades-long stranglehold on x86 held by the triumvirate of Intel, AMD and VIA Technologies. Details are also emerging that outline how AMD has managed to stay within the boundaries of the x86 licensing agreements but still allow Chinese-controlled interests to design and sell processors based on the Zen design.

The cat's out of the bag now.  The structure of this "deal" is legally dubious at best, and it's guaranteed to buttrape Intel eventually.  This is exactly the sort of horse**** that the Chinese pull all the time, multi-level structures that look ok on the front end but result in a 100% technology transfer and then the Chinese stealing said technology wholesale, screwing the owners who aren't Chinese.

This isn't one company that does this every now and again, it is a formal policy of the Chinese government.

We need a 100% trade embargo with these **********s and we need it now.

If this crap is not stopped and everything stolen returned -- 100% of it, either in economic value or physically -- then a complete embargo of anything produced in China will be the only way American technology firms survive.

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User Info We're Going to Have To Legally Shoot Them in forum [Market-Ticker]
Posts: 2058
Incept: 2010-11-07

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Can you project a time line for the destruction of AMD and Intel based upon previous examples of Chinese theft?

Fellows "deal" sure didn't last long.
Different industry but a well known example of Chinese treachery and US Corporate foolishness.

5 years max?

Preparing to go Hunting.
Posts: 153486
Incept: 2007-06-26
A True American Patriot!
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Yep -- about five years, maybe. And what's worse is that there will almost-certainly be PLA-inserted back doors into the AES instruction set that will make a flat out of joke out of same by exposing to the keying to the Chinese.

Winding it down.
Posts: 67
Incept: 2012-04-26

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I've always maintained that China should never be building anything tech-wise for the US. Socks, underwear and tee shirts is all they can be trusted with. Same goes for ANY communist nation.

Please God, take it all away!
Posts: 547
Incept: 2017-06-27

The People's Republic of New York
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since electronics can last a very long time absent abuse with some minor maintenance and occasional repair, some of us who keep a few spares of older but very good PC components have a new reason for some minor stockpiling. do not know what is worse, software or hardware spying.

this is all due to an often overlooked factor that goes beyond the commodification issue. this factor affects the car industry majorly and is determining their decisions now to a very large extent. i call it the good enough wall. for even rather serious office and internet use, even some processor intensive applications, most computers made over the past ten years are just fine, including the software. this means that absent a great innovation that people feel that they need, the only margin growth is in lowering costs of manufacture. cars have the same issue. the good existing ones, even from the nineties (the quality brands from then might actually do the job better than today's models), are competition for the new products and carry a lower price point. the public gets confused by all of the choice in a saturated market and shuts down. gimmicks like Windows 10 can only get you so far and the manufacturers are only getting a replacement cycle. cars are getting like computers where one cannot really differentiate the brands.

this AMD decision and similar by the auto mans seem to be due to this situation and it will not end well for them. regular people are loading Linux on seven year old computers and having better, cheaper and faster machines than new higher end ones. i cannot tell you how many even upper middle class people that i know who are driving ten and more year old Japanese cars that are well maintained, reliable and problem free. something is shifting. AMD will eat this decision. a really good chip maker would create a more secure system to beat the competition not a less secure system. once the Chineseium hardware is out there, the industrial espionage will go nuclear.

overlapping these strategies in these two industries shows that they are facing slowing growth since bad monetary policy allowed marginal players to play the system for profit growth not based on fundamentals and not fail when needed. this action by AMD is a medium term way of maintaining profitability for another five years in a margin compressing market with low product differentiation and low demand and is a close parallel with the auto industry that needs to do the same and is looking for its five years profit growth absent good fundamentals of consumer demand, innovation and failure of marginal players.

you can also see this with the dreaded smartphone. i know a phone nut who is always getting to newest Android creation. he cannot tell the different in quality of experience any more, or features. his favorite phone is actually two years old. the market is saturated. prices must go way down. there is nothing more that he can do with a phone absent a major redesign that companies like those described above will not and often cannot do in a margin compressed environment. it is all cost cutting and financial games like AMD and auto financing to keep the scam going another five years. watch your investments accordingly.

There are two ways to be rich: One is by acquiring much, and the other is by desiring little.
snow, seasons, distance and dirt roads: SSDD
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked; for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap" (Gal. 6:7)
Posts: 648
Incept: 2015-01-29

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The real tragedy here is that the Chinese weren't able to strip the executives of the companies involved of every penny that the US executives, board members and their families have. I put this right up there with *******s at Apple and other companies screwing Americans by moving their manufacturing to the glorious people's republic. **** YOU!!! You and your dumb-ass shareholders and bondholders deserve to lose everything.

Anytime I get an opportunity to buy knock-offs of US products that the company foolishly chose to have made in China, I buy the knock off every ****ing time and I don't feel bad about it in the least.

"I'd like to live just long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next 10 generations that some favors come with too high of a price." -Vir Cotto Babylon 5
Posts: 44
Incept: 2013-01-31

United States
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Why not just go exponential on them?

A 1 percent increase in (x) every third day at Noon PST.

A memorable lesson in math for the American History books.

At some point even Americans will admit that it looks and feels
very much like a slave's collar.


Posts: 67
Incept: 2012-04-26

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@Whitehat "regular people are loading Linux on seven year old computers."

Went to Linux Mint distro several years ago with hardly any issues compared to Windows. Now, after reading this site long enough, I have switched to FreeBSD and Fluxbox window manager almost exclusively. Granted, it was a massive learning curve just to get the basics up and running but this thing flies unbelievably fast. 8 or 16 gigs of ram? Why? I've yet to use over 1 gig. Total novice still but their forum members are very helpful...if yer not an ass.

Sorry if this is off topic Karl.

Please God, take it all away!
Posts: 424
Incept: 2012-10-11

Northern VA
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I'm trying my best to reduce my computer footprint to single purpose Raspberry PIs; backup, file storage, firewall, etc.

My laptop is now 8 years old. It came with Vista and got slipstreamed back to XP immediately. It was painful but it worked well for years. Once it didn't, I went to xUbuntu and haven't looked back.

I support Windows as a career, but I don't pick it for the things I need to get done.

I don't want a car with the basic controls of climate or radio integrated into the screen they were REQUIRED to be added to the car. So no 2017 or up cars for me, ever.

I buy $500-$1000 cars, bring their systems up to snuff, drive em for a few years, and buy another when I feel like it.

I get a new (to me) car quite often, and often make a profit on the car itself.

I'm surprised none of these companies knew that anybody/thing Asian is ONLY about the money.

I thought AMD had more sense than this.

And I laugh!
Posts: 34
Incept: 2009-12-06

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Speaking of Chinese theft....



Posts: 465
Incept: 2008-02-23

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Speaking of Chinese theft....

While the media obsesses over the Russians. smiley
Posts: 561
Incept: 2008-04-12

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Said it before: Chinese R/D = Receive and Duplicate

I am surprised this story hasn't made news headlines:

Massive Chinese counterfeit safety parts installed on Boeing planes, flying public, your life is compromised

Posts: 4711
Incept: 2007-12-11

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Long Vaseline....

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