The Chinese: Liars In Trade AND Sanctions
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2017-12-27 07:00 by Karl Denninger
in International , 179 references Ignore this thread
The Chinese: Liars In Trade AND Sanctions
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Tell me again why we don't toss our so-called "free trade" with China right here and now.....

According to South Korean government sources, the satellites have pictured large Chinese and North Korean ships illegally trading in oil in a part of the West Sea closer to China than South Korea.

The satellite pictures even show the names of the ships. A government source said, "We need to focus on the fact that the illicit trade started after a UN Security Council resolution in September drastically capped North Korea's imports of refined petroleum products."

Nothing moves in China without some sort of explicit government knowledge and consent.  The banks are all connected to the Central Committee in some form or fashion, and while corruption is endemic there anyone who believes that in a communist nation huge oil tankers are moving cargo around which has to be paid for somehow without the Chinese government knowing about it and deliberately turning a blind eye to it has rocks in their head.

Therefore Trump is either a 2-bit lying sack of crap pussy or he means what he says.  As a result we must either drop any pretense of China being an "honest" government (in which case all "free trade" must cease -- here and now) or it is clear that Trump and America at-large have no intention of doing anything with North Korea of import until and unless a warhead comes down on an American city.

If we as Americans allow China to "maintain" their "free trade" status in this environment we deserve to get nuked by the Norks.

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Nevertoolate
Posts: 1451
Incept: 2007-08-26
A True American Patriot!
San Antonio de Bexar de runover with illegals, Texas
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My father was in military intelligence all of his professional life. In 1968, after the Pueblo incident (which he said then was a Chinese provocation via N Korea) he predicted that the US and the USSR would fight against the Chinese at some point in the future. Both Putin, Trump and the world, needs to deliberately put ever increasing pressure on them because they dont care about anyone but themselves. Best outcome is to collapse their economy and have a regime change, but that is wishful thinking versus WWIII.

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Democracy is a conversation between 2 wolves & a sheep discussing what's for dinner. A Constitutional Republic is found when the sheep pulls out a gun & makes clear that his 2nd Amendment Right will be exercised should the wolves attempt to hold such a "vote."-KD 9-29-15
Themortgagedude
Posts: 10479
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saint louis
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This NORK mess is so easy to solve. You go to the Chinese and tell them that they either trade with us and get rid of Kim. Or they live with Kim and don't trade with us.

You also go to Putin and agree to fight Islamic terrorists with him. You give him Syria in exchange for his support in North Korea.

You secretly give Kim a couple billion and passage to China.

Then the Russians, China, US and South Korea meet to come up with an interim government in the North.

You leave the United Nations the hell out of it.

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I think its time we ask ourselves if we still know the freedoms that our founding fathers intended for us. Ronald Reagan 1964
Tdurden
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Right now, my big concern is that Lil' Kim doesn't have guidance systems accurate enough to hit any whatever target he's aiming for to keep one of those nukes from falling on to something important on it's way to a major political target. As it stands today, if the Norks ended up vaporizing DC or NYC or LA, I may have a hard time accessing my sense of grief for that kind of "loss."

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"I'd like to live just long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next 10 generations that some favors come with too high of a price." -Vir Cotto Babylon 5
Tickerguy
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Quote:
As it stands today, if the Norks ended up vaporizing DC or NYC or LA, I may have a hard time accessing my sense of grief for that kind of "loss."

Honestly? I'd tip a glass.

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Winding it down.
Nevertoolate
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A True American Patriot!
San Antonio de Bexar de runover with illegals, Texas
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TMD -If SOS position opens up, I nominate you.

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Democracy is a conversation between 2 wolves & a sheep discussing what's for dinner. A Constitutional Republic is found when the sheep pulls out a gun & makes clear that his 2nd Amendment Right will be exercised should the wolves attempt to hold such a "vote."-KD 9-29-15
Tdurden
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Quote:
Honestly? I'd tip a glass.


There may have been some sarcasm dripping off of my initial statement :)

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"I'd like to live just long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next 10 generations that some favors come with too high of a price." -Vir Cotto Babylon 5
Themortgagedude
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saint louis
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I only need a week. :)

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I think its time we ask ourselves if we still know the freedoms that our founding fathers intended for us. Ronald Reagan 1964
Whitehat
Posts: 261
Incept: 2017-06-27

The People's Republic of New York
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as much as MAGA man talks about the trade imbalance with China he will not cutoff their access to our markets. they produce too much in the current economic arrangement to the benefit of large business interests. it is a high spread arbitrage where too much money is made to voluntarily give it up. there must be an incident which no one, including the Chinese, want to happen. changing would also crash our economy, even if it would benefit us long term.

if a major coastal area, especially if NYC metro, is destroyed two things would occur. large coastal areas are a wealth storage vehicle for the very wealthy and corporate interests, especially the Chinese who are moving money out of their tenuous market. there would be an unimaginable loss of wealth destroying major financial institutions and markets. secondly, the coastal drain on the country in terms of opportunity, politics and business would free other regions to attempt to go on their own way. the country is too much in debt to finance a rebuilding and there would be massive opposition to it. there would be much competition to spread the wealth. the entire states where the city is destroyed would fail and not be able to meet any of their obligations.

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There are two ways to be rich: One is by acquiring much, and the other is by desiring little.
snow, seasons, distance and dirt roads: SSDD
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked; for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap" (Gal. 6:7)
Orionrising
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The most interesting point in this is that the Koreans are claiming this is satellite imagery vs aerial, and they are by far the clearest military imagery I have ever seen released. and its at oddly low angles.
Click
Posts: 76
Incept: 2017-06-26

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"Free Trade" is a misnomer, and a misnomer is a euphemism for a lie. Free trade is what the government(s) label their totally controlled exchange of goods and services, but it's just the opposite of free trade. If trade were actually free, it would mean that any American citizen would be able to trade with any Chinese citizen, freely, with minimal (or totally without) governmental interference.

Regarding Beijing's support of Pyongyang: Trump knows the score. He has always known Beijing is behind North Korea. Trump made that clear from the start. Really, Trump is currently negotiating with Beijing more than Pyongyang. This is all about posturing between Beijing and Washington. Anybody who has even the slightest clue understands China is the key to resolving the NK situation. If there's a war, it's because Trump and the Chinese Communists failed to agree on a non-violent resolution. Personally, I believe there's a 50/50 chance of a resumption of war on the Korean peninsula... So be ready.

I've said this before and it bears repeating: Trump is not a house cleaner. He's not the type of guy who is going to try and remove the foreign and domestic cartels that run the global system. Trump will continue to make deals with the cartel leaders. Call those people what you will: "swamp creatures" or elites or ****heads or call them "whatever", but don't expect Trump to do any different than he's ever done, viz., make deals with whomever he can. And don't expect Trump to not benefit the big, transnational corporations by making deals that are in the best interest of big business home based in the American Empire. Trump isn't going to use the executive branch of the American Empire to tear down the rule of the swamp and replace it with justice and rule of law. Trump grew up in the Concrete Jungle, and the law of the jungle is what I expect from him. Support Trump if you support living in a stronger ( less weak) empire. Support Hillary and Obama(and the Dirty Dems) if you want to slip into a neo- Dark Age... If you support "rule of law", then understand there's nobody in government for you to support; and there probably never shall be in the foreseeable future...

DT is the best ****er-in-Chief you're gonna get.... Sorry, but this is the sorry state of affairs we are all stuck in.
Tickerguy
Posts: 151190
Incept: 2007-06-26
A True American Patriot!
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Well I pick "NOTA" and he can suck my dick.

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Winding it down.
Supertruckertom
Posts: 1613
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USA
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Radio Edit

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Preparing to go Hunting.
Xkn
Posts: 58
Incept: 2011-04-30

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While rockets are launched from NK, button is in Beijing. Does anyone believe that country as miserable as NK can master the metallurgy to create rocket engine? Machining said materials to desired shape? Guidance systems?
Rockets started flying as Trump announced he wants "better trade deal" with China. Well, better deal for US can only mean worse (still good, but worse) deal for China and they do not want it. They are OK with the current "deal" and want it to stay that way. NK will never launch anything without getting order from China. For a simple reason, without Chinese support, NK would cease to exist within weeks. Think food! NK is a non-entity, as NK can only do what Beijing masters tell it to do. Nuclear war is not an option, and will not be an option for many years, or ever, for a simple reason, it would be bad for business - for China.
About the only thing which could possibly make china dump NK is to allow Taiwan, Japan, S. Korea and Vietnam to go nuclear. But even in that case, they could still use NK to commence nuclear attack, on Beijing orders, and then get smoked in retaliation by an attacked country. But this is one-time deal, so overall, Kim vs. ring-of-nukes around China, I think they would choose wisely. Unlike US government, Chinese tend to always choose what is best - for China.
Whitehat
Posts: 261
Incept: 2017-06-27

The People's Republic of New York
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@ Kkn, yes, they are capable. never underestimate your opponent. they are highly intelligent, in possession of many metals and alloy materials, motivated and not distracted to the extent that exists in a consumer society. stir in some desperation. war sucks, but it has produced unbelievable levels of human ingenuity and invention under some of the worst circumstances. necessity teaches. singlemindedness is also a factor. because they do without, they have the other strength of learning to make use of what they have. this always works for a people. those who work with the basics tend to understand tech at a deeper level. want to trade places with the engineers who designed the USA space program of the 60's and 70's using hand calculations??? the required discipline makes them much more competent. easy access to tech is oftentimes a curse on human capability. i personally witnessed this when learning side by side with European science students who had home country pre-university education, 80's and 90's. very primitive there at the time, but they were much more capable.

putting out there that NK might be China's think tank/laboratory. no one else is postulating this, but it does explain a lot. it is known that NK is very capable in the areas of high tech and quite accomplished. do not judge them on their greater masses starving. if people there are necessary and useful, they are provided for and have an amazing sense of purpose. then only way that we could defeat them as a people would be to inflict a massive country wide destruction campaign with no mercy and a sick level of cruelty to their general population. we did this already to a similar magnitude to the entire Pacific campaign of WWII. oh, notice that years later they are still here. even nuclear will not totally break them due to their topography. the US ability to win and use their bunker-buster weapons is a marketing campaign so that we feel superior and achieve half century results. if you want to win totally, you must take land and occupy it. FEEL LIKE A BLOOD BATH TODAY???

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There are two ways to be rich: One is by acquiring much, and the other is by desiring little.
snow, seasons, distance and dirt roads: SSDD
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked; for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap" (Gal. 6:7)
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