| User Info
| Public Employee Union Pensions: Ban Them in forum [Market-Ticker]
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Jotapay
Posts: 16836
Incept: 2008-08-26
Tx
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My [relationship removed] works at the Texas Teachers' Retirement System. The finance managers have pushed for more leeway to invest in riskier and riskier asset classes over the past few years. They've also been pushing for even bigger bonuses for themselves. The legal team attempts to keep them in check by forcing them to cancel deals they make which aren't in the teachers' best interests.
The fund managers decided to move their offices from the already-paid-for state government building just East of the capitol to swank new offices in a private building right on Congress and 8th Street at a huge cost to the taxpayers. They are really living high on the hog there, trying to emulate their role models at GS and JPM.
Rick Perry always has one eye on the ~$90 billion teachers' retirement fund. He wishes he could get his fat paws on it for his pet projects and leave some IOU's in its place but Attorney General Greg Abbott has shot him down several times in disputes at TRS when Perry did some unethical things. Usually these were over appointments where Perry is trying to ram his own people in there to steer things his way, if memory serves correctly.
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Mekantor
Posts: 30
Incept: 2009-01-12
Houston, TX
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Crzymorse
Posts: 1229
Incept: 2010-06-25
Maryland
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"Well, you know they have to pay high wages to attract qualified people to run the fund."
"Their pay is inline with the industry average."
The tell tale calling card of a Financial Terrorist. Like a pig on truffles or **** whatever your preference.
The response should be - show me the track record with investment returns of those qualified individuals. If they were any good they would most likely still be working at Goldman Sachs and MS.
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Mortgageguymn
Posts: 1584
Incept: 2009-03-09
North Coast
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For all government employees everywhere (union or non-union) defined-benefit plans should be converted to defined contribution plans. Whatever money's there is there, and there's no more. Deal with it.
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Andysvw
Posts: 1878
Incept: 2010-06-26
Tujunga Ca
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Isn't that special. Zombi states run into the ground to fleece its own people.
This does not happen by chance. It is being done with malice.
Oath taker approved. They are active participants.
When a technocrat says you dont understand its because they have been lying to you.
When a politician says its complicated its because they are hiding the truth.
How does government work? Not the way you think.
Why cant they fix it? THEY DID. Oath takers set it up this way.
What does it matter? If the judge says its ok then its ok.
Isn't that right Hillery.
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Curbyourrisk
Posts: 3605
Incept: 2008-08-19
Farmingdale, NY
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Too Big CONNECTED to fail.
Taxpayer bail out if things goes wrong.
Must not upset the leeches....
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Time is up.
I hate to burst your bubble, but there is no Santa Claus, the tooth fairy does not exist and American justice does not involve the courts.
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Trades50
Posts: 4238
Incept: 2007-10-30
Land of Tax and Spend
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Quote: Taxpayer bail out if things goes wrong And the the teachers, firemen and policemen are rather cocky about it. They deserve it and they have a guarantee.
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When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty. - Thomas Jefferson
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Flappingeagle
Posts: 1249
Incept: 2011-04-14
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Without the taxpayer backstop a government pension is nothing but a 401k.
We need to remove the government backstop and structure the pension such that if it looks like he money will be short, that everyone starts taking the hit right away. None of this overpaying current retirees so that you drain the funds and have nothing for those who are currently working and paying into the fund.
Flap
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Here are my predictions for everyone to see:
S&P 500 at 320, DOW at 2200, Gold $300/oz, and Corn $2/bu.
"You can't build a house of cards on a shaking table." - Tony Johns
The January 2015 AMZN put at $130 (cost $4.25) will be a winner.
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Drb
Posts: 195
Incept: 2011-01-02
TX
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TRS is an extremely convoluted and opaque system - http://www.texastribune.org/2010/10/20/w.... In higher education, defined benefit plans were converted to defined contribution plans a long while ago so that only people who are now retiring have them. This is perfectly logical. In contrast our illustrious, fiscally conservative governator receives both pension AND salary: http://www.texastribune.org/2011/12/16/p....I guess fiscal conservativism applies only to peons/plebes/serfs. Reason: added link
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Cobra2411
Posts: 10516
Incept: 2007-06-26
Philly P.a.
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Karl, I don't think you understand. If the trading goes well everyone wins. If it doesn't then the government comes in and helps out. How you figure this hurts the people is beyond me... 
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Government: A device that allows you to get blind ass drunk and your children get the hangover.
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Finaltable
Posts: 7
Incept: 2010-06-22
Houston, TX
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I believe that "high, steady returns" are possible with private equity purchases in a non-Ponzi scheme manner. Investments in private REITs and MLPs are available to those with access returning 7-8% annually. These investments are usually illiquid so getting out is difficult, but if the intent of the purchase is return on investment over a long time horizon these investments do exist.
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Eaglewwit
Posts: 6054
Incept: 2007-11-30
SoCal
Banned
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Oh look someone who believe in skittle ****ting unicorns.
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Noodleman
Posts: 2509
Incept: 2008-11-01
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Our electric company that services millions just got a rate increase approved by the regulating governing body that included a rate increase to cover the losses sustained by their employee pension fund in the 2008 crash. So the ratepayers are FORCED to backstop their gambling habits. This would be like somebody handing you $10,000 of Vegas gambling money and telling you to keep whatever you won but that any losses were forgiven in advance. In fact, if you lost the $10,000 you would get refunded, even though it wasn't your money to start with. So why not double and triple down at the riskiest tables? It's really a no-brainer.
This vicious cycle will never end. Why? Because the politicians and the judges are all part of the same pension system. Why bite the hand that feeds ya?
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"It may be true that you can't fool all the people all the time, but you can fool enough of them to rule a large country." William James Durant, 5 Nov 1885 - 7 Nov 1981
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Bertdilbert
Posts: 2694
Incept: 2008-12-22
CA
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Here is the reason they do private equity. The fund managers (or consutants) get kickbacks for directing the money at the private equity firms. Since the stock they purchase is not publicly traded they can be flexible on valuation models.
When I looked at CALPERS years back the money outside the normal stocks and bonds raised a red flag with me. Sure enough, an ex director was getting paid off to steer money to alternative investments. I have not looked a the Texas system annual report but I assume the same crap goes on. Pension funds should be locked into publicly traded stuff that has the market set the price, not hinky deals where stuff has the ability to happen under the table.
These funds need to be locked into public market trading only, no private deals valuation model price setting.
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Dear Euroland: Relax, Germany has a plan for your money!
Political Capital Defined: We are out of money but will tax our citizens for whatever it takes to "SAVE" the Euro.
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Joyce
Posts: 110
Incept: 2012-01-08
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Noodleman,
Exactly. Even in a bankruptcy, you think the judge [presumably from another jurisdiction to avoid conflicts of interest (does the gov in care about those anymore?)] is going to set a precedent slashing benefits by 90% or similar?
Bertdilbert said:
"...publicly traded stuff that has the market set the price..."
Surely, you jest good sir.
or
Pull the other one.
(both lines from the same movie)
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Drb
Posts: 195
Incept: 2011-01-02
TX
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Erkme73
Posts: 92
Incept: 2010-10-23
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I just learned from my retired police officer neighbor that none of the police ever had to pay social security taxes... Instead, they paid into their pension.
Can this be for real? How are they exempt from that?
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End_the_bubbles
Posts: 9596
Incept: 2009-03-25
The New 3rd World
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In the long run even the most despotic governments with all their brutality and cruelty are no match for ideas. Eventually the ideology that has won the support of the majority will prevail and cut the ground from under the tyrant's feet and rise in rebellion to overthrow their masters.
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Eaglewwit
Posts: 6054
Incept: 2007-11-30
SoCal
Banned
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It is absolutely for real Erk, it is essentially a 10% pay increase. The reasoning is that they are participants in a public pension scheme, and will not need SS since their public pension is guaranteed to them by law.
One pig is more equal than the other.
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Donethat
Posts: 782
Incept: 2009-04-22
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Erkme73, yup, All the little state and local governments were running their own "social security" pension Ponzis, their employees were outside social security. In some places government realized the big Ponzi had best be left with the Feds and reduced or eliminated defined benefit plans and put everyone or at least new hires back on social security.
Back in the day, ATT, General Foods, US civil service etc had beau Coupe defined benefit Ponzis, even the union pension plans were fat.
Government trying to keep up with cream of pension benefits results today in big pain coming down the road for either all those people who never paid into social security or the taxpayers who are funding the Ponzis, even bigger pain than those who did.
Birth rates in the US cratered during the Great Depression, so the big suck was not so painful until the first wave of Boomers hit 65 two years ago.
Keep watching Calpers try to sue bankrupt cities for pension contributions. Who gets their wallets emptied first, taxpayers or retirees?
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Flappingeagle
Posts: 1249
Incept: 2011-04-14
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Quote:Public Employee Union Pensions: Ban Them The perfection of your title: Public Employee Union Pensions: Ban Them Public Employee Union Pensions: Ban Them There should not be ANY defined benefit plans either public or private UNLESS you can convince me that there will not be a government bailout of any form when one or more fails to deliver on its promises. We already have the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation which works at our expense (if not now it will once the defaults get large enough). It needs to go away and stay away, we CANNOT reward risk taking and promise making when the burden falls on the taxpayer when things fall apart. Let's be Capitalists, Flap
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Here are my predictions for everyone to see:
S&P 500 at 320, DOW at 2200, Gold $300/oz, and Corn $2/bu.
"You can't build a house of cards on a shaking table." - Tony Johns
The January 2015 AMZN put at $130 (cost $4.25) will be a winner.
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Noodleman
Posts: 2509
Incept: 2008-11-01
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"I just learned from my retired police officer neighbor that none of the police ever had to pay social security taxes... Instead, they paid into their pension."
Many cops pay nothing in pension contributions. All funded by the taxpayers. Some pay a small contribution like 3%. Why would cops or public safety have to be part of the social security system when they get $100,000 pensions or more as young as at age 50?
And some can even fund a 401-K equivalent and the first 3% is matched by the government.
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"It may be true that you can't fool all the people all the time, but you can fool enough of them to rule a large country." William James Durant, 5 Nov 1885 - 7 Nov 1981
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Genesis
Posts: 131485
Incept: 2007-06-26
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Quote:We already have the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation which works at our expense (if not now it will once the defaults get large enough No it doesn't. By law you get whatever is there. And it HAS been tested -- ask an airline pilot.
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I don't care if it makes sense -- only if it makes money. -- Me
Bank (n): See scam, fraud and theft. Eat a bankster -- they're low-carb.
What part of "shall not be infringed" was unclear?
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Joyce
Posts: 110
Incept: 2012-01-08
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What does the PBGC do?
If private pensioners would only get what was left after banktrupcy proceedings, whats the need for the PBGC?
Added bureaucracy, patronage jobs, etc etc, but what's the stated reason?
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