Quote:

Bullets first.....

Yep.

videopro, i might agree with you but there are JUST TOO MANY people with guns for self defense, and many more now starting to think about it.

most people don't like bullies, and they don't like being bullied-and this might unite formerly disparate groups of people.

the printing presses (and their misuse), though, may very well destroy this country.

sometimes when outnumbered by them, i tell libs :

"I disagree with what you say, but i must defend to the death your first amendment right to say it....". (pregnant pause) "and when things get that bad i want to be armed."

How about a nation wide open carry day? On that day we could all be equals again.

Quote:

I can see them giving this a test run in New York.
Thing is it might not fly the same in rural Georgia or Tennessee.

Or Michigan, or West Virginia, or Pennsylvania, whatever. Nobody I know in these states will hand over their weapons.

I hope Brush is right. I hope many resist. I hope we all do what we say we're going to do here, and resist.

It really kills me to see people post such things as, "If they come, you'll surrender rather than die."

**** you. That may be your plan, but it sure as hell is not mine.

My plan? They show up at my door, I will judge them in violation of the Constitution of the United States and sentence them to immediate death. I will then proceed to get as many of the traitors dead as I can before they undoubtedly figure out how to work their big scary guns (the same type they're trying to confiscate from me) and kill me.

I will die, of course, but sometimes blood has to be shed before people either get serious about what they believe or just lay down and take it and get shipped off to Treblinka. So either get serious or get ready to lay down in a hole.

Any way you slice it, none of us are going to get out alive.

I'm prepared to die to defend my family and The Constitution of the United States of America. If we reach the point of gun confiscation I will determine the best course of action to inflict the most damage ever done by one man with the resources I have available. My contribution to this fight WILL BE more then to just sacrifice it to take out a couple of foot soldiers. They can have whatever guns they find in my house... That is if they show up before I go on the offensive. That's all I'm going to say on this matter for obvious reasons. Talking about defending the Constitution makes you a domestic terrorist these days... That should tell you all you need to know about what's coming if this government doesn't change course.

Msheffi972 : anti-gunners are ignorant and only use their emotions, not facts to form their ``opinion``.

Hell my mother thinks that if you get a gun, magically, trouble will appear on your doorstep. Basically, having a gun to her means your chances of getting murdered increase 10 000 folds!

Anti-gunners really think that if you ban guns, all the guns in the world are gonna disappear and nobody is gonna be killed ever again. They forget that the sickos don't disappear and that even if all guns disappeared tomorrow, the playing field would be : the bigger attacker always wins... and the weird thing is that most statists I know are women and women have the most to lose if guns were banned tomorrow since they are weaker physically...

Statists are statists because they live in their own dream world where when a law is written, everything in the world will follow it and everything will be peachy.

ill just say.. its a bad plan to sit on your couch and wait to take one person out when the swat jbt breaches you door

much more interesting things you can do. much more.

From the thread on Fed-Up's forum here, seeing as how NY has PUBLISHED the names and addresses of CCW holders, I'd say the balloon is already up.

Downrange, they tried to do that here in Oregon but various groups prevented them from publishing permit holder names.


Another delight from MSNBC:

White people are scared...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELNML7iyQ....


Local gun show this weekend in the Oregon state capital was very very busy. Line out the door to get in, few guns available (small show) and high ammo prices.

Jonx

Hard to find parts are best handled by friends that are machinists or investing in private lathes and mills. You can make a production run. Just hope you don't need black market. It is fairly easy to set up a home CNC system these days.

Some defensive measures one can employ:

Flame throwers
Napalm
Hi power microwave radiation
Infrasound (expensive but extremely effective)
Trap doors at entryway (perps drop into container below)
Poison gas jets around entryway
Buried explosives at property perimeter
Thousands of bullets embedded in trees with solenoid hammers activated remotely (I like to call it "forest fire")
Tesla coil -high voltage shock
Electrified surfaces
Nozzles that spray sulfuric or muriatic acid.
Propane tank bombs

The first thing you do is turn on the microwave transmission. Cops won't be able to handle their weapons without severe burns, shocks. If they continue to advance, turn on the infrasonic device and watch them all fall over vomiting and twitching wildly. Your neighbor's houses may be destroyed during this process if any are with a 1/4 mile of your weapon, so use with caution. Other options are to spray them with chloriform gas and then incarcerate the bodies as hostages. Now you have a bargaining chip. Many other strategies too.

Yes, I've been thinking about the engineering of this since 1997, when the probability of my unlicensed FM station being raided by SWAT teams was becoming clear to me.

I like some of those ideas, Basspig. A few of them would be nearly free and simple for me to implement. Hhmmzzz

You could warm all their coffees with that microwave Basspig. Maybe you could hang boxes of dounuts in the trees.

Nice list Basspig. Not one item on your list includes using an "Assault Weapon".

Learn guerrilla warfare tactics...

someone like James Bond flicks. lol.

A bit of movie-watching, I think.

Bass,

other than perhaps an anger management session or a decaf diet, I rather admire your creativity. the microwave oven thing sounds quite interesting...

anyone know the range of an open microwave oven ?

Wonder if you could adapt a microwave bulb to run in a porch light

"I'll be right there! Just 8 minutes or so"

I wasn't talking about a microwave oven here. More on the lines of military aircraft base radar (the kind that fries whole flocks of unfortunate fowl who have the misfortune of flying through the beam.) A phased array of antennae, aimed carefully down the main entry paths to your property can be very effective. Pulsed radar is practical here, as continuous would be limited by residential electric supply.

Oh, I also forgot about the pulsed Co2 laser. Imagine walking through an invisible beam of light and then falling to the ground in two pieces. ;-)

I've had some 'history' of animosity with my local taxing authorities in the past 27 years, and more clashes with the feds over the exercise of the 1st Amendment in an effective manner (unlicensed broadcast station). Some people consider me to be a genius with electronics. I consider myself competent at building many of these systems.

A note about the ubiquitous natural gas: A couple who were upside down on their mortgage blew up their home, with the explosion killing their neighbors, and damaging 89 other homes. 39 homes were damaged so badly they are going to be demolished. This explosion was done with gas, using a microwave oven to detonate. Gas is available to anyone. We don't see the gov banning gas, do we?

Out yonder here is what is going on..

http://www.standard.net/stories/2012/12/....



Utah teachers pack gun training classes

By Paul Foy

The Associated Press

Thu, 12/27/2012 - 5:07pm

Clearfield lawmaker: Teachers lining up for gun class

Ariz. AG wants to arm school principals



Related Slideshows








Teachers taking gun classes



WEST VALLEY CITY — Jessica Fiveash sees nothing wrong with arming teachers. She’s one herself, and learned Thursday how to safely use her 9 mm Ruger with a laser sight.

“If we have the ability to stop something, we should do it,” said the elementary school teacher, who along with nearly 200 other teachers in Utah took six hours of free gun training offered by the state’s leading gun lobby.

It is among the latest efforts to arm or train teachers to confront assailants after a gunman killed his mother and then went on a rampage through Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., killing 20 children and six adults before killing himself.

In Ohio, a firearms group said it was launching a test program in tactical firearms training for 24 teachers. In Arizona, the attorney general is proposing a change to state law that would allow an educator in each school to carry a gun.

The moves to train teachers come after the National Rifle Association proposed placing an armed officer at each of the nation’s schools, though some schools already have police officers. Parents and educators have questioned how safe the proposal would keep kids and whether it would be economically feasible.

Some educators say it is dangerous to allow guns on campus. Among the potential dangers they point to are teachers being overpowered for their weapons or students getting them and accidentally or purposely shooting classmates.

“It’s a terrible idea,” said Carol Lear, a chief lawyer for the Utah Office of Education. “It’s a horrible, terrible, no-good, rotten idea.”

Kristen Rand, the legislative director for the Violence Policy Center, a gun control advocacy organization, said to believe that a “teacher would be successful in stopping someone who has made the decision to engage in a shootout is just not rationale.”

“No teacher is ever going to be as effective as a trained law enforcement officer,” Rand said. Even trained police officers don’t always hit their targets, and arming teachers could put innocent students at risk of crossfire, she said.

Gun-rights advocates say teachers can act more quickly than law enforcement in the critical first few minutes to protect children from the kind of deadly shooting that took place in Connecticut. They emphasized the importance of reacting appropriately under pressure.

“We’re not suggesting that teachers roam the halls” looking for an armed intruder, said Clark Aposhian, chairman of the Utah Shooting Sports Council, the state’s biggest gun lobby. “They should lock down the classroom. But a gun is one more option if the shooter” breaks into a classroom.

The group waived its $50 fee for the training. Instruction featured plastic guns and emphasized that people facing deadly threats should announce or show their gun and take cover before trying to shoot. They cautioned teachers about the liability that comes with packing a gun in public.

“It’s going to be a hassle. It’s another responsibility. You can’t just leave your gun lying around,” Aposhian said. “Not for a minute.”

The teachers at the basic gun training applied for a concealed-weapons permit, submitting fingerprints and a mug shot for a criminal background check. The class kicked off as an instructor in the “psychology of mass violence” offered various tactics to disrupt an assailant.

The first, the instructor said, was to start with the command: “Stop right there!”

“I wouldn’t hesitate to shoot if the danger was immediate,” said Fiveash, adding that her laser sight would make shooting in tight quarters safer.

English teacher Kevin Leatherbarrow said he often felt threatened while working at an inner-city school in Buffalo, N.Y., where he got a license to carry a pistol. He moved less than a year ago to Utah, where he feels safer. But he said gun violence can break out anywhere.

Leatherbarrow said he was highly trained in handling guns — and was taking criticism from parents who don’t appreciate his views on school safety.
“I’m in agreement not everybody should be carrying firearms in school. They’re not trained. But for some parents to think we’re cowboys, that frustrates me,” he said. “I wish parents would understand.”

In the U.S., the number of homicides at schools of children, ages 5-18, have been lower year-by-year in the 2000s than they were in the mid- to late-1990s, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics report on school crime released in 2012. At 32 deaths, the 2006-2007 school year was the only one that reached the levels from the 1990s. The manner of death was not listed.

Utah is among a few states that let people carry licensed concealed weapons into public schools without exception, the National Conference of State Legislatures says in a 2012 compendium of state gun laws.

Utah educators say they would ban guns if they could, but legislators left them with no choice. State law forbids schools, districts or college campuses from imposing their own gun restrictions.

Educators say they have no way of knowing how many teachers are armed. Gun-rights advocates estimate 1 percent of Utah teachers, or 240, are licensed to carry concealed weapons. It’s not known how many do so at school.

“I never felt threatened in 14 years of teaching, but I don’t think you can be too prepared,” said Tiffany Parry, a dance teacher from Sandy who applied for Thursday for a license to carry a concealed gun. “I think it could come in handy.”

Gotta love this guy!!!

Teachers line up for gun class

Clearfield lawmaker: They can stop a threat to children when seconds count

By LORETTA PARK
Standard-Examiner staff lpark@standard.net   CLEARFIELD — One local representative is offering a reducedcost concealed weapon permit training course for educators.
“No one is forcing teachers to do this, but those wishing to do so, we are encouraging them to get more training,” said Rep. Curt Oda, RClearfield.
Ever since the Dec. 14 massacre at a Connecticut school, Oda, a concealed weapon permit instructor, has heard from a number of educators who want to take the course.
He has not set a specific date but said it will be sometime after Jan. 1. The course will cost $20 for anyone currently employed by a school district. Normally, the course costs $70. Those taking the course also will have to pay the $47 state permit fee. “Seconds count in most situations like the one in Sandy Hook (Elementary),” Oda said.
“Help from law enforcement is minutes away always. Yes, law enforcement did a good job, but when it is your responsibility to defend yourself and others around you, you need to be prepared. Police do a great job, but 90 percent of the time, they are there to clean up, not to prevent.”
Oda said Utah and Kansas are the only two states that allow people with a concealed weapon permit to carry a gun in schools.
Utah school districts and universities cannot restrict those with concealed weapon permits from carrying guns on campuses, said Clark Aposhian, chairman of the Utah Shooting Sports Council.
Aposhian is also offering a course for anyone employed with a school district. His free course is being taught today in West Valley City.
There were 200 slots available, and he said those were all snatched up by Wednesday morning.
Based on the number of people wanting the course, Aposhian said he will offer another course after the first of the year. “We’re not suggesting that teachers roam the halls for a monster,” Aposhian said. “They should lock down the classroom. But a gun is one more option if the shooter comes in.”
A major emphasis of the required safety training is that people facing deadly threats should announce they have a gun and retreat or take cover before trying to shoot, he said.
“Schools are the safest place for our kids to congregate, and when something like (Sandy Hook) happens, it shocks us to the core,” Aposhian said.
He said having those who work inside the schools trained to handle a shooter is similar to training a school employee how to use a fire extinguisher in case of a fire.
“We’re not pretending they are professional firefighters, but they’re there to intervene when a fire threatens,” Aposhian said.
For more information about the courses, call Oda at 801-725-0277 or email Aposhian at clark@fairwarn  ing.biz  .
The Associated Press contributed to this article.


Oda