Claims and ADP - What?!
The Market Ticker ® - Commentary on The Capital Markets
Posted 2012-07-05 09:16
by Karl Denninger
in Employment
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Claims and ADP - What?!
 

Ok, now this one I can't understand....

Employment in the U.S. nonfarm private business sector increased by 176,000 from May to June, on a seasonally adjusted basis. The estimated gain from April to May was revised up slightly, from the initial estimate of 133,000 to a revised estimate of 136,000.

Employment in the private, service-providing sector rose 160,000 in June, after rising a revised 137,000 in May. Employment in the private, goods-producing sector added 16,000 jobs in June.

Manufacturing employment added 4,000, reversing May’s decline.

Eh..... Really?

Most of the gain was in medium and small firms -- all but 11,000.

And then we have claims:

In the week ending June 30, the advance figure for  seasonally adjusted initial claims was 374,000, a decrease of 14,000 from the previous week's revised figure of 388,000. The 4-week moving average  was 385,750, a decrease of 1,500 from the previous week's revised average of  387,250.

Now that is a large drop!

The big report, on the other hand, was net -20.4k, with a drop in extended benefit programs partially offset by a gain in regular claims of 13,164.  This is a June 16th number, and thus will go into the report for tomorrow.

It's very tempting to drag tomorrow's numbers higher, especially with the ADP report.  But I just can't get there from here given the numbers in the big table, total unemployed being 5.8 million (and that just being those who are collecting benefits!) and badly-deteriorating regional numbers such as the Philly and Richmond Fed indices.  While none of the regional indices have tipped into outright employment contraction as of yet, hours worked are another matter, and that typically precedes outright employment contraction.

I will maintain my +100k +/- 50k guess for tomorrow.

Discussion below (registration required to post)
 

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User Info Claims and ADP - What?! in forum [Market-Ticker]
Aztrader
Posts: 6648
Incept: 2007-09-10
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Scottsdale, AZ
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Are these ADP numbers only full-time jobs or are they using Obama accounting at 1 hour a week?
Ghopper
Posts: 2302
Incept: 2011-06-11

Staten Island, NY
Online
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Of course the interesting question about tomorrow's NFP numbers is...how much will the Birth/Death adjustment be?
Mortgageguymn
Posts: 1562
Incept: 2009-03-09
Green
North Coast
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The American Community Survey (from the Census Bureau) asks if you've worked at least one hour during the last week. That depends whether time analyzing Obama's fake birth certificate counts as working.
Sybdragon
Posts: 369
Incept: 2008-10-02

kentucky
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The facts on the ground as I see them....

One guy hubby knows fell off the unemployment payments a week ago. He was collecting $350 a week for the last 3 years. His wife is still collecting but not sure how long. Hubby's friend (used to work with him). He wasn't looking for any work but now is looking and freaking out. He probably has any and all benefits they will give him along with 2 kids, teenagers or pre-teens anyway.

My one friend's hubby is out of work and been out of work around 6 months now. Collects no unemployment payments at all and never did. No benefits at all although they could probably get EBT but he won't apply. He won't file taxes even though he's owed money, wants nothing to do with .gov....

I haven't worked a job since '99 and I hit the 18-wheeler. Hubby quit work around 2 years or so now. Got EBT around a year or so ago. And now... we are leech****s, yep, bigtime leech****s. Disability got approved and just waiting on the check. Hubby got medicaid too. I couldn't get medicaid but I did ask.

Ever lived with someone that is clinically depressed, bi-polar, and cann't sleep? Very frustrating and takes all your emotional strength from you, worse than living with an alky and I've lived with both types, although my hubby is not an alky, just depressed and driving me craaazzzzzyyyy!!! Won't do a damn thing, like taking care of a baby without having to change diapers smiley

If you would have asked me around 5 or so years ago. I would have told you this was impossible as I would have died first. Then I got over it. Looks like Karl is getting over it too. smiley The frustration I see in his postings is getting bad...... I do not care if the country collapses anymore. It's not my country anyway. My country died a long time ago and noone noticed..... smiley

The nephews got jobs at the brake factory where their parents worked. They hate it of course. smiley

There are no jobs around here. I hear them advertising 'looking' for work on the radio. Lots of stuff for sale around here if you got money. Any toy you want.

Read today that Obama cut the funding by 70% to the helicopter patrol that looks for pot in Kentucky. Makes me so happy... Funny how little things make you happy when you have nothing to look forward to, isn't it? And I don't even grow pot. I'm tired of that fight too. I'm tired, just damn tired of it all....
Mannfm11
Posts: 3536
Incept: 2009-02-28
Gold
DFW, Tx
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I think there is a huge seasonal adjustment in June or July, due to layoffs in the auto industry to retool. Last week revised upward only 1000, which probably means they didn't need to make this weeks number look much better. What claims and jobs don't show is that people are broke. New jobs are likely not as good as the old ones.

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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
Xqqme
Posts: 625
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Ohio
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'My country died a long time ago and noone noticed..... '

+1
Colk55
Posts: 2413
Incept: 2010-02-11
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Indiana
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NSA claims were right around where they were last week, a little lower because last week's NSA number was revised up.

Mann, a jump in NSA claims that results in that big adjustment should be coming, if not in in next week's report, the week after.

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The politician's motto: If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull****.
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