| User Info
| It's Ok To Manipulate Markets in forum [Market-Ticker]
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Anti
Posts: 4295
Incept: 2007-10-09
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"forego bonuses.." probably would have been smaller than the ones they already collected from the scam.
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Health is better than health insurance http://gerson.org/ Over the past 60 years, thousands of people have used the Gerson Therapy to recover from so-called “incurable” diseases such as cancer, diabetes, heart disease and arthritis.
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Nevertoolate
Posts: 1219
Incept: 2007-08-26
San Antonio de Bexar de runover with illegals, Texas
Online
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Three classes in America today: 1.CONgress 2.BANKsters 3.The rest of us. The rules apply only to #3.
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"Socialist never mind stealing, as long as they are the ones doing the stealing. They never mind lying, as long as they are doing the lying."-Mannfm11
Before you attempt to beat the odds, be sure that you can survive the odds beating you.
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Resistance
Posts: 6162
Incept: 2008-09-26
Banned
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Don't forget the security apparatus for groups 1 & 2; they play by different rules as well.
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"Why must political experiments always be in the direction of more government? Why not give the free market a county or even a state or two, and see what it can accomplish?"Murray Rothbard - The Fallacy of the Public Sector
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Preidt2
Posts: 552
Incept: 2009-07-31
spokane/wash
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fines should be what they make plus.....corruption adminstration plus..... No benefits after public service..... Public service not self service....
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Puppets Under Destruction
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Translator
Posts: 58
Incept: 2010-07-03
Columbia Gorge
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Another website just quoted this from Solzhenitsyn. It fits: Quote:In keeping silent about evil, in burying it so deep within us that no sign of it appears on the surface we are implanting it, and it will rise up a thousandfold in the future. When we neither punish nor reproach evildoers, we are not simply protecting their trivial old age, we are thereby ripping the foundations of justice from beneath new generations.
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Everybody’s comprehensive list for medical care:
“I want the best medical care in the world, and I want somebody else to pay for it” A.D.E.
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Irishblues
Posts: 287
Incept: 2010-12-18
Wisconsin
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Not that it excuses their actions or states that the fine being paid is in any way adequate [what should be following are criminal indictments, prison terms, and permanent exclusion from the LIBOR rate-setting mechanism, among other things], but at least the executives are giving up their bonuses. That's more than any senior executive at Citibank, Bank of America, Pfizer, etc. have done when their corporation was caught red-handed committing illegal acts after being busted once already for the same thing.
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Sagebrush
Posts: 9
Incept: 2012-03-12
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No one should be above the law but, the Big Bank Parasites have figured out that they can buy everyone involved with legislation, regulation, enforcement, and prosecution and flat out ignore the law. Pay paltry fines for violating gutted regulations and let the huddled masses scream and yell their heads off. The Sheeple still haven't figured it out. The Banks rule the twenty first century.
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Buddy
Posts: 157
Incept: 2008-10-25
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Yeah, and besides market manipulation with cheaply fined fraud, likely political influence. And you have people such as these with unethical and unlawful control: From ZH The external trader thanked Trader G for Barclays’ LIBOR submission later that day: “Dude. I owe you big time! Come over one day after work and I’m opening a bottle of Bollinger" http://www.zerohedge.com/news/shocking-d....
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Gweedo
Posts: 100
Incept: 2010-11-12
Florida
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If they're that high up on the food chain, couldn't they conceivably "give up their bonuses" and at the same time just increase their salaries? Nice... Quote:Barclays Chief Executive Officer Robert Diamond and other executives... Didn't Robert Diamond have like a $27mln pay package? So he's giving up a $6.5mln bonus while the bank was fined $400+mln. How much financial damage did this guy and his cronies do to the GLOBAL financial markets that he has EARNED/IN WORTH $27mln in salary?
Reason: Quoted article
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Cobra2411
Posts: 10346
Incept: 2007-06-26
Philly P.a.
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Karl, if you were a BANKster and stole a paltry $50 from the stop-n-rob you'd pay a massive 200 penny fine. That surely would keep you from doing it again. Oh and no free coffee for you on your next visit... Harsh I know, but it's the only way... 
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To err is human. To really **** things up takes government.
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Throxxofvron
Posts: 10325
Incept: 2009-02-17
Hyper-Speculative Psycho-Facsistic Parabolic Blow-Off
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How many People ALL over the ****ing world took out Adjustable Ream Mortgages? Weren't every Single ONE of Them robbed by this blatantly illegal collusion and price fixing by the Banking Cartel? I'll ask again: How exactly will voting for the Red Banking Cartel Bank-Rolled Douche over the Blue Banking Cartel Bank-Rolled Douche 'FIX' this? Does One Dollar Of Capital somehow 'FIX' this either? I can assure Everyone here that I KNOW HOW TO FIX THIS.-It will only require primitive tools such as rope, wooden beams and some steel rigging. Believe Me: I know how to 'FIX' All of these *******s. ...Permanently. Quote:Shocking Details Of Barclays Epic Lie-bor Fraud: "Duuuude…Whats Up With Ur Guys 34.5 3m Fix…Tell Him To Get It Up!"
Submitted by Tyler Durden on 06/27/2012 09:54 -0400
Wonder how deep the rabbit hole goes? It goes very, very, very deep.
From the FSA' breakdown of Barclays traders caught in the act of manipulation:
On Friday, 10 March 2006, two US dollar Derivatives Traders made email requests for a low three month US dollar LIBOR submission for the coming Monday:
i. Trader C stated “We have an unbelievably large set on Monday (the IMM). We need a really low 3m fix, it could potentially cost a fortune. Would really appreciate any help”;
ii. Trader B explained “I really need a very very low 3m fixing on Monday – preferably we get kicked out. We have about 80 yards [billion] fixing for the desk and each 0.1 [one basis point] lower in the fix is a huge help for us. So 4.90 or lower would be fantastic”. Trader B also indicated his preference that Barclays would be kicked out of the average calculation; and
iii. On Monday, 13 March 2006, the following email exchange took place:
Trader C: “The big day [has] arrived… My NYK are screaming at me about an unchanged 3m libor. As always, any help wd be greatly appreciated. What do you think you’ll go for 3m?”
Submitter: “I am going 90 altho 91 is what I should be posting”.
Trader C: “[…] when I retire and write a book about this business your name will be written in golden letters […]”.
Submitter: “I would prefer this [to] not be in any book!”
More:
The number of requests and the period of time over which they were made indicate that the Derivatives Traders made requests on a routine basis. Specific emails also indicate the requests were made regularly. For example, the following email exchange took place on 27 May 2005: Submitter:“Hi All, Just as an FYI, I will be in noon’ish on Monday […]”. Trader B: “Noonish? Whos going to put my low fixings in? hehehe” Submitter: “[…] [X or Y] will be here if you have any requests for the fixings”.
More:
In response to a request from Trader C for a high one month and low three month US dollar LIBOR submission on 16 March 2006, a Submitter responded: “For you…anything. I am going to go 78 and 92.5. It is difficult to go lower than that in threes, looking at where cash is trading. In fact, if you did not want a low one I would have gone 93 at least”.
More:
Trader C requested low one month and three month US dollar LIBOR submissions at 10:52 am on 7 April 2006 (shortly before the submissions were due to be made); “If it’s not too late low 1m and 3m would be nice, but please feel free to say “no”... Coffees will be coming your way either way, just to say thank you for your help in the past few weeks”. A Submitter responded “Done…for you big boy”.
More:
On 6 August 2007, a Submitter even offered to submit a US dollar rate higher than that requested: Trader F: “Pls set 3m libor as high as possible today” Submitter: “Sure 5.37 okay?” Trader F: “5.36 is fine”
More:
On Thursday 14 December 2006, Trader F emailed a Submitter, requesting a low three month US dollar LIBOR submission for the following Monday, 18 December 2006; “For Monday we are very long 3m cash here in NY and would like the setting to be set as low as possible…thanks”. The Submitter instructed another Submitter to accommodate the request; “You heard the man” and confirmed to Trader F “[X] will take notice of what you say about a low 3 month”.
Two seconds later, that Submitter sent himself an electronic calendar reminder to make a low three month submission at 11 am on Monday 18 December 2006: “USD 3mth LIBOR DOWN”.
It just gets better:
For example, on 26 October 2006, an external trader made a request for a lower three month US dollar LIBOR submission. The external trader stated in an email to Trader G at Barclays “If it comes in unchanged I’m a dead man”. Trader G responded that he would “have a chat”. Barclays’ submission on that day for three month US dollar LIBOR was half a basis point lower than the day before, rather than being unchanged. The external trader thanked Trader G for Barclays’ LIBOR submission later that day: “Dude. I owe you big time! Come over one day after work and I’m opening a bottle of Bollinger"
And better:
For example, on 6 September 2006, an external trader at another bank (Panel Bank 1) contributing EURIBOR submissions sent an instant message to Trader E at Barclays requesting a low one month submission: “I seriously need your help tomorrow on the 1mth fix”. The next day, Trader E passed on the request to Barclays’ Submitters, blind copying in the external trader.
And better:
On 28 February 2007, Trader B made a request to an external trader in relation to three month US dollar LIBOR “duuuude… whats up with ur guys 34.5 3m fix…tell him to get it up!!” The external trader responded “ill talk to him right away”.
And other banks:
Barclays’ Submitters also received 11 requests for sterling LIBOR submissions from an external trader at another bank (who had previously worked at Barclays). These requests were not taken into account.
And truly stunning:
Trader E communicated with traders at Panel Banks 1, 2 and 6 in advance of the IMM date. For example on 12 February 2007, Trader E stated in an instant message with a trader at Panel Bank 6: “if you know how to keep a secret I’ll bring you in on it […] we’re going to push the cash downwards on the imm day […] if you breathe a word of this I’m not telling you anything else […] I know my treasury’s firepower…which will push the cash downwards […] please keep it to yourself otherwise it won’t work”.
And, in the end, the punchline:
Various instant messages exchanged after the final benchmark rates were published on 19 March 2007 indicated that the traders involved considered that their strategy had been successful. Trader E commented to the external trader at Panel Bank 6 “this is the way you pull off deals like this chicken, don’t talk about it too much, 2 months of preparation […] the trick is you must not do this alone […] this is between you and me but really don’t tell ANYBODY”.
Absolutely sickening. Read the full thing here.
Our advice to anyone who had an adjustable rate mortgage in the period between 2005 and today: speak to a lawyer immediately about suing the living feces out of Barclays, and all other banks who crawl out of the woodwork with purported settlements. Because due to their undisputed mark manipulation, it is absolutely safe to say that ARMs, which rely on Libor for interest rate formation, were grossly manipulated by the same idiot traders who left written evidence of their manipulation year after year. Now it is their turn to pay.
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DIONYSUS: " Thou hast no knowledge of the life thou art leading; thy very existence is now a mystery to thee. " -from 'The Bacchantes' By Euripides “During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.” -George Orwell
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Jwm_in_sb
Posts: 1041
Incept: 2009-04-16
California Desert
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Yeah see they have to earn those huge sums in order to be able to "make political contributions " because otherwise they might start getting in trouble.
still think voting will solve this? It won't. We're not represented anymore. the money from wall street has to be extracted from the political process or this will only end through voilence .
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Stuki
Posts: 88
Incept: 2009-01-29
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If markets can be profitably "rigged", they will be. Noone with sufficiently sharp elbows and a sufficiently honed me-first instinct to climb to the top of any big organization, will last long if he does not avail himself of such opportunities. The fairytale that Mr. Robert Diamond is somehow some weird outlier is plainly silly. If he were to forego the opportunity to make a buck risk free by skinning some other person's newborn alive, number two in line would step up to the plate, and take his job. Simple as that.
The only failure here, is that there is ONE "Interbank market", and that there is regulation protecting this status quo. Drop all and every law that give gullible suckers the illusion that there is someone "regulating" this for the benefit of anyone but themselves and their immediate constituencies, and noone would sit there like stooges while those well placed rob them. Then rinse and repeat wih pretty much every other law; perhaps excepting the ones God gave to Moses on Sinai, and we're on to something.
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Analog
Posts: 543
Incept: 2010-12-29
arkansas ozarks
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Quote:“this is the way you pull off deals like this chicken, don’t talk about it too much, 2 months of preparation […] the trick is you must not do this alone […] But (sput sputter stammer) --- Cant be anything to it, just couldn't... after our venerable and pious regulators put Martha Stewart in jail to put an absolute stop to that sort of thing ? Sure made the streets safer didn't it?
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Steelhead23
Posts: 2042
Incept: 2008-09-09
Portland OR
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Apparently it is not criminal to manipulate the markets if you are TBTF. However, if you run a smallish hedge fund, not so much. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/philip-fal....Unfortunately, these are civil actions. Falcone borrowed (stole) over $100 million from his fund, conducted an illegal short squeeze, etc. and as punishment is expected to pay it all back and never do it again. American justice is a joke.
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"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes it's laws" —Mayer Amschel Bauer Rothschild Benjamin Bernanke For-profit commercial banks are a menace and should be eradicated
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