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There was a story on Italian news that housing prices dropped 20% last quarter alone.

Kwerk, your article talks about residential home and commercial property SALES (i.e. transactions), not prices.
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With regards to the substance of this thread, from what I've seen, heard, and read in the non-English press, it seems that Monti has inextricably linked the idea of EFSF and ESM bond buying to those countries IMPLIMENTING AND OBTAINING OBJECTIVES WITH FISCAL REFORMS. The EFSF and ESM are legally capable of buying bonds (in fact, that is to be one of their main objectives). The idea is a sound one if and only if it is limited to countries who are actually implementing the necessary changes. Theoretically, it is logical to support a country who is turning itself around by bringing its borrowing costs more in line with their future prospective borrowing costs once their fiscal reforms start bearing fruit.


Here's something more in English http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-2012....

No it's not... but it sure sounds good when you're there and worried the "dirt" under your feet is in fact **** and all it will take for it to liquify and you to sink is a bit of water!

Not just for the sake of argument, but to continue with your metaphor, if the drunk is "on the wagon" and participating in AA, shouldn't the rest of us lend him/her a helping hand to continue towards a "life in recovery"?

Of course, the type of helping hand may be debatable, and, in this case, where credit is the "abused substance", help with interest payments could be easily confused with more "drug", as though we were passing them the "bottle". Or it could be likened to giving the patient some sort of "medication", much like heroin addicts are given methadone. Or we could "dislink" the concepts completely, and treat subsidized interest payments as something similar to the subsidized housing provided to those in recovery who are also indigent.

Regardless, in the appropriate analogies, the "help" is provided AS LONG AS the individual is in recovery. At the first signs of relapse, the aid is cut off.

I think those are sensible programs for individuals - programs that put the onus on personal responsibility. Why not something similar for entities that have gone awry, but have recognized their error and are now in recovery?

A very apropos and timely example (again) is Spain, who ratified the Fiscal Stability Treaty today (with overwhelming opposition support as well) that limits the government deficit to 0.5%. All EU members have to ratify the treaty, and starting March 1, 2013, no EU member can receive bailout funds if they haven't previously done so. Sounds like a plan for European countries in rehab. http://www.invertia.com/noticias/congres....

Info in English thanks to the Irish: http://www.iiea.com/irelands-referendum-....

Countries "on the wagon" (and a notable exception): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Rule.... (needs updating)


Add: If you were to do a solid balance sheet analysis of Europe, and European countries individually, who would come out on top in a Euro Zone break-up? I'm not the least bit worried. ;-)

Keep believing...

Considering that there's nothing comparable on your side of the Atlantic, I'll be here as your grateful friend ready to assist in your relocation efforts once you finally believe.


Add: In the meantime, I'm going to donate again as a sign of support. Market Ticker and Ticker Forum most certainly deserve it!

Talkin' 'bout Spain, I'm considering a pilgrimage on "The Way" to Santiago. Protestant style, lol. Who knows? If Gen turns out to be right I might combine the spiritual aspects with a bit of property scouting. (Like I said, "Protestant style." Booya...")

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http://www.theway-themovie.com/



THE WAY is a powerful and inspirational story about family, friends and the challenges we face while navigating this ever-changing and complicated world. Martin Sheen plays Tom, an irascible American doctor who comes to France to deal with the tragic loss of his son (played by Emilio Estevez). Rather than return home, Tom decides to embark on the historical pilgrimage "The Way of St. James" to honor his son's desire to finish the journey. What Tom doesn't plan on is the profound impact this trip will have on him. Through unexpected and oftentimes amusing experiences along "The Way," Tom discovers the difference between "the life we live and the life we choose.”

Man, if you've got the legs and feet for it, you'll never regret it. (And if not, then you hire out a car to carry your stuff, make regular hotel reservations, and just hit all the most important stops - which are plenty, especially if you're into Romanesque and Gothic architecture, not to mention the fantastic scenery, food, people, etc., etc.)

Cars... Hmm... We're talkin' bicycles too... (I know, blasphemy, lol...) All the way from Notre Dame though... More than 1400 kilometers (850 miles)... Four weeks?...

Very doable, assuming you've done the previous training and are prepared for day-in-and-day-out pedaling (which I imagine you already well know). Many do arrange for a support car/van, but if you're going to do hard core touring with panniers and the like, then my hat's off to you. Mountain bike fitted for touring would be my recommendation, and perhaps off-season so as to assure yourselves of camping sites (open camping is pretty much forbidden just about everywhere), or hostel space (they fill up by mid-afternoon during the summer). Sounds like you know what you're doing so I won't bore you with more basics. Sounds like fun. Wish I still had the legs (and back) to join you!

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Some impolite things do need to be said though, the topics discussed here are serious ones with implications much nastier than any harsh language.

I'm with you. I embrace uncomfortable truths, especially those that are typically shunned or dismissed for being impolite. My concern lies in improperly laying blame, especially when it's stated in inflammatory ways that have a high risk of being seized upon by venal, unaware, unthinking individuals as justification for their bigotry.

The anti-prohibitionists and pro-equal rights factions have been under attack for many, many years. Their attackers raise their boldness with each new success. Granted, the victims react inappropriately or inadvisedly. But isn't that a lot like blaming a******victim for getting beat because she fought back in a less than optimal manner?

The federal government had no right to get involved in marriage in the first place.

Of course Italy's in trouble.

The Fiat 500 looks like ****, Ferrari is 4th in the manufacturers challenge, Gina Lollobrigida isn't getting any younger, Fellini died nearly 20 years ago and Italy is 12th in FIFA rankings.

Almost forgot. Obesity rates in Italy two-year-olds are the highest in Europe with a rate of 42% (wiki)

I'd say they're in trouble.

Two wrongs don't make a right.. It was unconstitutional to require government approval for straight people to marry, and it will be unconstitutional to require government approval for gay people to marry as well. Spin them as brave if you want to, but what they're pushing for is yet another glaring 1st Amendment violation.

At least back when women were second class citizens there was some moral justification of violating the Constitution to protect them, now that they are equal the "defense" provided by those laws has become an offensive weapon they do not need, and which gay people never needed.. And of course a chance for The DNC and GOP to secure the gay and Christian vote, respectively, using nothing but cheap words.

Basically, the entire gay marriage debate is a false dichotomy, with neither road leading to constitutionality. Since nothing good can possibly come of it, the whole battle is a monumental waste of time and energy.

Again...government has no business interjecting itself into a covenant made between two consenting adults and God.

None whatsoever.

Morla, thanks for this comment

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Since nothing good can possibly come of it, the whole battle is a monumental waste of time and energy.

So true!