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| Oh, Obama Lied About Obamacare? (No, Really?) in forum [Market-Ticker]
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Joejohns
Posts: 694
Incept: 2010-09-09
Banned
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Obama and the others don't care enough to lie.
They are given a couple of options and then once picked the talking points/propaganda to push it becomes all that matters.
To read much more into it than that will just confuse the course one should take.
They don't care beyond getting power and as to the results of the "programs" no person living can tell what they will be.
All prognosticators have a poor track record, public or gvt.
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Porkchop
Posts: 143
Incept: 2007-07-15
Joliet, IL
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Absolute SHOCKER!
I remember Obama pitching this **** on WLS way back when...he said passing Obamacare was necessary to SAVE $100B over 10 YEARS! What we deficit spent in 2 1/2 DAYS!
And if I recall correctly to CBO admitted, before the piece of **** legislation passed that 15% of hospitals would immediately/eventually go bankrupt...so my question was (at the time) we let this happen or bail them out, but if we bail them out, what happens to the $10 B is savings?
PS I still think they are underestimating the cost
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Mortgageguymn
Posts: 1566
Incept: 2009-03-09
North Coast
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Not perfectly relevant, but perhaps connected, Ann Barnhardt had an interesting commentary yesterday, entitled "Caesar Tyrannus Obama, I Will Not Submit". http://barnhardt.biz/ |
Vitchilo
Posts: 4615
Incept: 2011-04-27
Online
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You know if you say that to Obamabots, they'll say that it's still cheap... $176 billion a year... no biggie. And this is weird... Quote:As expensive as it is, the CBO predicts the law will actually reduce the deficit because it increases the income from a range of tax increases and penalties on individuals, employers and insurance companies -- by $81 billion more than last year's projection. So... the bill is gonna cost 176 billion/year but the income will go up by 81 billion... so it'll be a deficit?? Do the CBO knows how to use maths or???
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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -- H.L. Mencken
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Viper
Posts: 1064
Incept: 2007-08-28
Madison, WI
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You have to wonder if the person who writes stuff like this: Quote:As expensive as it is, the CBO predicts the law will actually reduce the deficit... Can actually do it with a straight face. I mean really? Do they expect us to be that stupid? Unfortunately, probably they do, and unfortunately they are probably right for a large number of Americans.  |
Marvinmartian
Posts: 751
Incept: 2011-03-16
Pasadena, CA
Online
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Obamacare, as enacted, isn't about health care.
Its about insurance, and charging equal insurance payments for all.
Its about making the healthy (generally the young) pay for the medical expenses of the unhealthy(generally the aged). There is now little financial incentive to stay healthy.
As the money flows in and out, the insurance companies are taking a generous cut for administrative expenses.
Its crony captialism at its worst. Some might even call it fascism.
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Widgeon
Posts: 13481
Incept: 2007-08-30
Region formerly known as the United States
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It already costs twice as much and they haven't hardly even left the "start" line yet.
Another year or two and it will double again.
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Jkilkelly
Posts: 1629
Incept: 2007-07-20
Mercer Island WA
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This will be worse than Medicare. When first enacted the sponsors or the CBO made a ten year projection. They were off in year ten by a factor of 10 times
We were far more honest and rational then than now.
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“They say there are no atheists in a foxhole. Well, there are no libertarians in a financial crisis, either.'' Jeffrey Frankel, Harvard economist
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Atlasrocked
Posts: 364
Incept: 2009-03-23
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Has anyone fact checked this? What page is the doubling estimate written on?
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Mdporter
Posts: 560
Incept: 2008-02-26
San Jose, CA
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Obamacare lied and PEOPLE DIED.
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Vitchilo
Posts: 4615
Incept: 2011-04-27
Online
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Mdporter : is this 2004 again or???
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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -- H.L. Mencken
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Azusgm
Posts: 2414
Incept: 2010-12-02
East Texas
Online
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Here's an alternative plan that is going through the states. It takes congressional approval, but the president does not have a vote. http://healthcarecompact.org/"Meteor" was the word the Texas state comptroller used too. |
Mdporter
Posts: 560
Incept: 2008-02-26
San Jose, CA
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Quote:Mdporter : is this 2004 again or???
Not yet, I think you are going to have to wait a few years more to get there again. As the costs escalate obviously the unhealthy at some point will have to be allowed to die, including "the poor" and "the elderly". It's going to make other debates like Abortion pale in comparison. BTW this was being talked about in the medical community as early as the 1990's. even then the docs were wondering how the baby boomers were going to be cared for, because in their opinion it was going to break the bank. It'll get so bad we'll be comparing it to Hitler's eugenics programs. Unfortunately there is no way to care for everyone and it's going to be painful. Death happens to everyone. |
Marvinmartian
Posts: 751
Incept: 2011-03-16
Pasadena, CA
Online
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Mdporter wrote..As the costs escalate obviously the unhealthy at some point will have to be allowed to die, including "the poor" and "the elderly". Whats so painful about this reality is that for a large percentage of the population, being unhealty is about lifestyle choices that lead to ill health. Sedentary. Trans fats from processed foods. Diets high in omega-6 fatty acids from "vegetable oils". Carbohydrate addiction from Dept of Agriculture food pyramid. The sheeple are suffering from ill health, the institutions that treat them are prospering, those that take care of themselves are being taxed to support the inequity. Its time to opt out. Reason: fix the name being quoted
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Bangkokian
Posts: 40
Incept: 2010-09-17
Bangkok
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Yes, there's a wall ahead -- but who's to say that extend and pretend can't work for another 5 years, 10 years or 20 years? Maybe that "wall" is miles away. Where does this notion of "imminent collapse" come from? If a politician can pull a cute bunny out of a hat, and keep the crowd happy for another 10 years then that's exactly what's going to happen.
QE3 is around the corner -- and a zillion more variations of "stimulus" are on the way. Yes, it's doomed to fail in the long run. Of course you cant "solve" a debt problem with more debt -- but you can make that debt problem disappear for a good long time. The "long run" may be a generation away, and by then all these politicians will be old, rich and retired.
Yes the end is coming. But (unfortunately) I see little evidence that it is nigh.
Extend and pretend is a more potent weapon than most here like to believe.
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Xqqme
Posts: 626
Incept: 2009-01-09
Ohio
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You ain't seen nothing yet!
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Flyingillini
Posts: 87
Incept: 2009-06-09
Reno, NV
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Yeah, this will go up by 10x at some point. It always does.
**** Obama.
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Ben
Posts: 6208
Incept: 2009-10-09
The Distant, Glorious, Past
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"$176 billion a year."
It;s not going to be that cost per annum, and all of us here know it.
I expect it to swell to Medicare/SS levels in a few years.
Toss another $1T per year onto the pile.
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"Why are you going to learn French?"
"Because I'm going to France," says Joe.
"I'm from the future. You should go to China."
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Orionstarman
Posts: 222
Incept: 2009-08-04
Kingsville MD
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Within 6 months I bet the cost overruns will be pushing $3 trillion.
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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
http://www.enotes.com/history/discuss/what-does-this-quote-mean-they-that-can-give--84001
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Arius
Posts: 15
Incept: 2011-11-04
California/USA
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Unless we end the Welfare/Warfare State we are royally up the creek. The odds that we will end it? ZERO.
I came to that conclusion two years ago, that the US is on a death march into a brick wall then off the edge of a cliff. We are making plans to get off the train.
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Musicandnature
Posts: 1954
Incept: 2007-12-05
NJ
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Since it costs a lot to win, and even more to lose, You and me bound to spend some time wonder'n what to choose. Goes to show, you don't ever know, watch each card you play and play it slow...Wait until that deal come round, don't you let that deal go down, no no. Garcia/Hunter.
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Jstanley01
Posts: 8182
Incept: 2008-07-30
San Antonio, Texas
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Tickerguy wrote..This is how Washington works folks. Make claims that are patently false. On purpose.
Rig the scoring so the numbers come up "as you want", pass it, then stick the taxpayer with the truth later on. Yeah and, ya' know when this **** started? In 1913. NINETY NINE ****ing years ago, my fellow boiling frogs: Quote:In 1913, Wyoming ratified the 16th Amendment, providing the three-quarter majority of states necessary to amend the Constitution. The 16th Amendment gave Congress the authority to enact an income tax. That same year, the first Form 1040 appeared after Congress levied a 1 percent tax on net personal incomes above $3,000 with a 6 percent surtax on incomes of more than $500,000. — A Brief History of the IRS
http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2007/0.... Yeah and, do you know how what the $3000 personal exemption was advertised as by the politicos of the time? Enough to live on. Yeah and, ya' know how long that amount lasted before the politicos first bent the newly-coined taxpayers over the table? Till 1917 when it was reduced to $1000. Yeah and, ya' know what it is today (it's close enough to April you ought to)? $3800. LIES, LIES, AND MORE LIES. Yeah and, by the way, Wyoming, GSABFDADIAF. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_ex....http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/feddi.... (pdf)
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You can't cheat an honest man. ~P.T. Barnum
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Raftermanfmj
Posts: 3352
Incept: 2010-09-06
USA
Online
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Maybe it would be best to live on the border of Canada, where you could walk 100 yards and be in Canada...
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I have never wished to cater to the crowd; for what I know they do not approve, and what they approve I do not know. - Epicurus
Oderint dum metuant - Caligula & Police State USA
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Mannfm11
Posts: 3548
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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bangkokian wrote..Yes, there's a wall ahead -- but who's to say that extend and pretend can't work for another 5 years, 10 years or 20 years? Maybe that "wall" is miles away. Where does this notion of "imminent collapse" come from? If a politician can pull a cute bunny out of a hat, and keep the crowd happy for another 10 years then that's exactly what's going to happen. I'm amazed when I see these quotes. When politicians pull a bunny out of the hat and give it to us, we find out it is a Tazmanian devil. Germany got away with this stuff for 2 or 3 years after WW I, then it was suddenly recognized they were issuing credit they couldn't pay and their money collapsed. It went from enough to buy $1 million to worth 25 cents in 60 days. The only thing that is keeping this thing going is the rest of the world is broke with us and needs dollars to pay their own bank debts. There will either be no recovery or nothing for sale that the masses can afford. That will include healthcare, which has no price flexibility due to the fact the government manages it. When is it going to happen? Probably not tomorrow, but all this stuff is making it worse not better and the destruction of American credit along with the destruction of the US dollar will leave the entire world with no unit of trade. The entire world is a speculative bubble. Yes, the entire world. Some people think China is going to pull a bunny out of their hat as well, but they have built a crocadile that eats bunnies like they are Hershey kisses, bags at a time. This bill is going to do nothing but inflate drug dealer profits and put the bill on the middle class.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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