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| The People .vs. Goldman Sachs in forum [Market-Ticker]
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Steph4liberty
Posts: 1684
Incept: 2010-10-22
Raleigh, NC
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Taibbi is going to need his own security detail if he keeps this up. Hopefully he's invested in a remote starter...I, for one, want him to keep bringing the fraud to light.
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"Man will never be free until the last Banker is strangled with the entrails of the last Politician" - unknown
"This isn't a market anymore, it's a computer game." - Drench
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Bohemian
Posts: 9658
Incept: 2010-07-27
California
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Hey, Matt, stay out of hot tubs and crosswalks.
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"The politicians are put there to give you the idea you have freedom of choice. You don't. You have no choice; you have owners. They own you. They own everything." - George Carlin
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Trades50
Posts: 4217
Incept: 2007-10-30
Land of Tax and Spend
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Goldman is the syndicate of the financial industry. The main problem is their deeply entrenched in Washington as well as worldwide.
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When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty. - Thomas Jefferson
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Hogman
Posts: 7874
Incept: 2008-02-18
Derby City, USA
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Thanks Mt Karl (and Matt)
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Eaglewwit
Posts: 6054
Incept: 2007-11-30
SoCal
Banned
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What is the Statute of Limitations? These guys need to fry.
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Genesis
Posts: 130779
Incept: 2007-06-26
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Five years for securities fraud.
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I don't care if it makes sense -- only if it makes money. -- Me
Bank (n): See scam, fraud and theft. Eat a bankster -- they're low-carb.
What part of "shall not be infringed" was unclear?
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Reddweb
Posts: 436
Incept: 2008-01-20
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does that 5 years apply to bank robberies? So all bank robberies, financial fraud 5 years ago is all forgiven - soctt free?
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Reddweb
Posts: 436
Incept: 2008-01-20
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what do you get when you combine 17th century slave traders with 19th century robber barons? 21st century wall.streeters!
All of the above were perfectly legal during their times - as they were considered "part of the system", and the J6P masses accepted it (not by choice, its just a norm).
Modern slaves = entire world! they work their ass off and save money put in bank or investments, then the central banks come in and slowly squeeze it out - the actual squeezers are the wall.streeters (Central Banks are just means to an end)
This new plague is super-smart Harvard/Standford educated "normal people" and they are just doing what their seniors are doing. (just like normal, young savvy slavetraders did in 17th century)
yay! a new way to screw other humans!
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Mannfm11
Posts: 3551
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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They should start with water boarding 10 of them, with 9 of them watching the first one get the treatment. They probably won't have to water board the other 9, so they need not worry about the confession of the first being inadmissible.
I reread Taibbi's last report again last night, where John Mack's wife and another woman got a set on the tee deal for junk off banks balance sheets, where they had 10% risk and the government 90% on what was probably really deep discounted paper that has probably been pawned, piece by piece on other outfits. Borrow at zero and lend at God only knows what. He also made light to the banks borrowing at zero from the Fed and lending back to the government at whatever. You have a million I could borrow at zero Karl? I will lend it back to you at 5%. Isn't that a hell of a deal? So, they are putting the ball on the tee for people that might should be in prison. I also read the third and 5th comment to the post by a guy who says he bartended at John Mack's country club in the Carolina's. It was pretty graphic. I looked him up and send him an invite on Facebook to see what he had. Rather than write what he wrote here, it might be best for anyone interested to go read it. Bernanke should go to prison for this game alone. Leona Helmsley live in mass.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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Ktrosper
Posts: 1500
Incept: 2010-04-06
ft collins co
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Posted similar comment to another thread, but it really belongs here... Taibbi wrote..This is America: Corporate stealing is practically the national pastime... Think about that for a moment.. This doesn't go unnoticed by the rest of the world, either. At least not by the people paying attention , i.e. those with capital to invest. Gen wrote..If we can't see these guys prosecuted now... then you may as well put a fork in this nation and our ability to actually attract honest capital, from here or elsewhere. Is it niave to think that the first Nation to stand up and credibly protect property rights and ensure a fraud-free environment where business can be done will come screaming out of this recession? Wouldn't capital just fly into that type of an environment? KT
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The unexamined life is not worth living.-Socrates
The only stable state is the one in which all men are equal before the law.-Aristotle
Liberty exists now in the spaces government has not yet chosen to occupy.-Doc Zero
I anticipate that 10 Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders will blow me this evening.-K.D
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Mannfm11
Posts: 3551
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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Congress clearly doesn't have any balls. They have the nerve to charge Roger Clemens with lying to Congress over something trivial that was a standard procedure in baseball, then let these bastards game the country out of trillions, appoint them to high government offices, including the Fed, where they blatantly insider trade on information and put the chief fox in the Treasury. Obama clearly isn't nothing more than a mafia don, a criminal in a high place, or worse yet, he is just flat stupid. We would kind of hope he is just stupid.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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Duc888
Posts: 7368
Incept: 2008-11-06
CT, the UNconstitution State
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Quote:Congress clearly doesn't have any balls. Quite the opposite, they have the biggest ballz that the Banksters can buy. Laws are for peons.
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...burp
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Striker754
Posts: 671
Incept: 2009-07-09
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Reading that article is extremely depressing and reading the comments below it from the "free market" people is even more depressing.
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Jimg
Posts: 180
Incept: 2009-02-04
Dunedin, FL
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Mannfm11
Posts: 3551
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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striker wrote..Reading that article is extremely depressing and reading the comments below it from the "free market" people is even more depressing. There isn't any free market in the securities and banker business. If there was, all these bastards would be broke and in court suing each other. And being they couldn't pay their bills, the fraud would come out in court. Bernanke and Geithner have covered up one of the great crimes of all time, one I would rate up against Hitler and Stalin in the last 100 years. There will eventually be wars over this mess, maybe even a US civil war before it is done. I had tickets to the Yankees last weekend. Listening to these arrogant *******s bragging about buying players, when all I can think is the business in NYC is looting the world. I was actually on the verge of throwing one of these bastards over the upper deck. Next year I am selling my tickets. The rest of the US would be better off if NYC became Hong Kong and we outlawed doing business with them. You could build central Dallas for what they got in the WTC incident. Can't the people that suck trillions out of the rest of the world even clean up a fallen building without a bailout? If you think this doesn't matter, the NY Yankees are a bull market team, almsot exclusively. The 1920's and 1950's and early 1960's were their heyday, along with the late 1990's and this rebound rally in 2009. 76, 77 and 78 were pretty good bull years as well. Rarely have they done well in a bear market.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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Rutben
Posts: 1414
Incept: 2007-07-27
Phoenix, AZ
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So what is the statute of limitations for lying to Congress?
"Article 18 of the United States Code, Section 1001," says Loyola University law professor Michael Kaufman. "There are statutes that prohibit perjury and obstruction of justice, but this is the federal statute that explicitly prohibits lying to Congress."
The law is simple: You're guilty if you "knowingly and willfully" make a "materially false, fictitious or fraudulent statement or representation." The punishment is up to five years in federal prison”.
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Mannfm11
Posts: 3551
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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You know they got Raj on insider trading yesterday. Isn't selling some crap like this on inside knowledge insider trading? Clearly unclean hands, as it looks pretty plain they were digging **** and failed to wash up. On any account, wasn't Martha Stewart charged with dumping stock on insider knowledge? Is there really any difference? In fact, I think Goldman knew this stuff was crap when they bought it. Clearly Merrill did.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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Mannfm11
Posts: 3551
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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Taibbi wrote: Quote:Before the hearing, even some of Levin's allies worried privately about his taking on Goldman and other powerful interests. The job, they said, was best left to professional prosecutors, people with experience building cases. "A senator's office is not an enormous repository of expertise," one former regulator told me. But in the case of this particular senator, that concern turned out to be misplaced. A Harvard-educated lawyer, Levin has a long record of using his subcommittee to spend a year or more carefully building cases that lead to criminal prosecutions. His 2003 investigation into abusive tax shelters led to 19 indictments of individuals at KPMG, while a 2006 probe fueled insider-trading charges against the notorious Wyly brothers, a pair of billionaire Texans who manipulated offshore investment trusts. The investigation of Goldman was an attempt to find out what went wrong in the years leading up to the financial crash, and the questioning of the bank's executives was not one of those for-the-cameras-only events where congressmen wing ad-libbed questions in search of sound bites. In the weeks leading up to the hearing, Levin's team carefully rehearsed the moment with committee members. They knew the possible answers that Goldman might give, and they were ready with specific counterquestions. What ensued looked more like a good old-fashioned courtroom grilling than a photo-op for grinning congressmen. http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/new....This is at best muddying the subject. I would venture without looking that the Senate is full of ex district attorneys and even attorney generals of various states. That office is quite often a launching pad for political careers. If there aren't at least 10 people in that body that meet that definition, I would be shocked. At least 1/3 of them I would bet, are attorneys.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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Mgpacher
Posts: 142
Incept: 2011-03-03
Indiana
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I am thinking that Justice might just prosecute these people from Goldman Sachs for perjury. Obama would come across as the knight on the white horse taking down the hated fat-cat bankers. So he ends up throwing one of his biggest campaign donors under the bus. It would up his chances for reelection tremendously.
It scares the crap out of me that Holder might actually prosecute. The remaining banks will probably ante up out of pure fear to cover the campaign donation loss by the Goldman prosecution.
Then again, maybe this is just crazy reasoning.
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Rutben
Posts: 1414
Incept: 2007-07-27
Phoenix, AZ
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Trying to find answer to my own question, found this: (since what GS did is so "complex", couldn't one argue that "discovery" occurred during Levin's investigation?) Supreme Court of the United States held that a private securities fraud claim accrues for statute of limitations purposes at the earlier of when (1) the plaintiff does in fact discover, or (2) a reasonably diligent plaintiff would have discovered, “the facts constituting the violation.” http://www.corporatesecuritieslawblog.co....Found several links saying it was also 5 years for lying to congress, but also found this. Anticipating the groundswell of lying, maybe the law has since been amended to protect the guilty? (Securities and Litigation Reform Act?) Alger Hiss of passing classified documents to the Soviets during the 1930s. Hiss, a highly respected Democrat who held influential positions in the federal government during the New Deal, and who accompanied President Roosevelt to the Yalta conference in 1945, could not be tried for subversion; the statute of limitations had expired. But Hiss was convicted of lying to Congress. |
Mannfm11
Posts: 3551
Incept: 2009-02-28
DFW, Tx
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Mg, I would hope they would be prosecuted for originating, packaging and selling fraudulent securities. I have to believe that S&P was complicit with Goldman. It is hard to believe that Morgan Stanley got burned by them as well. If MS was that stupid, I wouldn't hire them to account for a 10 year old kids Kool-Aid stand. Yves, in her book, quoted a guy as saying Morgan Stanley had adopted an attitude of screwing their customers. Maybe turnabout was fair play. But, the idea that it is acceptable to peddle fraudulent paper without penalty in the US literally dooms the country to being nothing more than another banana boat republic. We can have all the debt and get by as long as business in the US is legitimate. This is literally treason.
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The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable.---John Kenneth Galbraith
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Dashingdwl
Posts: 9764
Incept: 2007-06-26
los angeles
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Sent this to an MD friend at Goldman Sachs. His emailed replied:
Taibbi is reckless and disgraces all ethical journalists. I expected more from Rolling Stone, but they can't sell magazines and this is perfect fodder for Joe Bagadonuts to read on the crapper.
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When you are hard and disciplined, you can be principled. People fear you because they have no leverage against you. It's the truest form of Liberty.
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Howie
Posts: 4848
Incept: 2007-11-02
Wilmington, DE
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May they all burn for eternity.
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"Banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. Already they have raised up a moneyed aristocracy that has set the government at defiance. The issuing power (of money) should be taken away from the banks and restored to the people to whom it properly belongs." - Thomas Jefferson
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Rutben
Posts: 1414
Incept: 2007-07-27
Phoenix, AZ
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"Taibbi is reckless and disgraces all ethical journalists".....yes, and tell him to add "Senator Levin is even more reckless and disgraces all ethical senators. His investigation was done so carelessly and in such haste, there probably isn't a kernel of truth in any of their findings".
Goldman stands alone as a beacon of ethics to be emulated, surpassing even the high bar set by Enron: "ethical behavior requires nothing more than avoiding the explicitly legal, that refusing to see the bad things happening in front of you makes you innocent, and that telling the truth is the same thing as making sure that no one can prove you lied". I've been carrying that around in my wallet for 10 years, suspecting some day it might become the standard.
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