There Are No More Criminal Laws in [Market-Ticker]

Posted 2011-01-04 08:19
by Karl Denninger
in Corruption

There Are No More Criminal Laws

The 50 state attorneys general probing U.S. foreclosure practices will first settle with the five largest loan servicers, including Bank of America Corp. and JPMorgan Chase & Co., Iowa Attorney General Tom Miller said.

Oh, so 150,000+ bogus affidavits - each an alleged count of perjury (and perhaps forgery) will lead to a felony criminal charge, right?

The group isn’t pursuing a criminal investigation, Miller said. “Our focus is to reform the servicing process and that’s inherently civil, not criminal,” he said.

I see.

So the standard is that if you're a bank, you can break the law.

Any law - and it's not criminal. At worst it's a civil matter. Maybe.

It's not criminal to break into someone's home when you have no right to be there (as has been documented in multiple cases) - if you're a bank, or employed by one. And it's not criminal to falsely swear before a court - if you're a bank, or employed by one.

This is sorta like how it wasn't criminal to launder drug money - if you're a bank, or wire money to a prohibited nation (for alleged terrorist uses) - if you're a bank, or to be involved in a massive bribery and other associated events scheme over a sewer system - if you're a bank, or to rig bids in the municipal debt markets - again, if you're a bank.

Well, it seems to me that if this is the standard for a bank, then the people are well within their rights to decide that the precise same standard shall apply to conduct directed at a bank.

That would be fair and just, right?

One would hope not. But hope is not a strategy, nor is it a reasonably expectation. Instead, we have the mealy-mouthed so-called "law enforcement" folks from our states who cannot in fact be bothered to..... enforce the law.

And here I thought our State AGs would actually perform their jobs and prosecute.

I guess not - after all, nobody has when it was drug money laundering, terrorist funding or ripping off state and local governments.

Why change the record now?

Discussion below (registration required to post)

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User Info	There Are No More Criminal Laws in forum [Market-Ticker]
Bhakta Posts: 71 Incept: 2009-12-03 Bangkok, Thailand	It is just --------- sick. No law enforcement of any kind left in the USA. Print trillions ad give it to banks. Screw all the people, all the time and laugh. Just makes me puke. 2011-01-04 08:25:51 Permalink
Ct1977 Posts: 231 Incept: 2009-08-13 East Hartford, CT	Whats a shame. This stuff makes me absolutely sick. They are getting away with murder and all they get is a slap on the wrist and a fine. What the hell is going on in this country? I bet any money the AG's had a gun put to their head on this. I'm sure they got the end of the world speech from someone if they really pursued the criminality of what occurred much like what congress did to FASB. It's stuff like this that makes me root for an all out crash of the financial markets. I want to see these people hurt, I want to see them shamed, I pray they are eventually exposed on a mass scale. Something is very wrong with our world today folks. If I walk into a store and shoplift I'm going to jail, no fine. How these people get away looting and stealing blows me away. 2011-01-04 08:36:11 Permalink
Ooo Posts: 1545 Incept: 2007-10-25 Virginia	This is the way our judicial system can work. You can make a deal with the prosecutor, (jurisdiction, state, etc.) pay a fine, restitution, get a slap on the wrist and move on. This saves the judicial system effort, time and money. However I believe this will come back to haunt all involved. This should be no surprise because the Banks are backed by the Federal Reserve, Treasury, and Federal Government. We already know Bernanke, Geitner, etc. have already lied and cheated... 2011-01-04 08:37:53 Permalink
Infidel Posts: 5463 Incept: 2007-08-27 between here and there	To big to nail ---------- "DON'T BELIEVE THEM, DON'T FEAR THEM, DON'T ASK ANYTHING OF THEM." -ALEXANDER SOLZHENITSYN. 2011-01-04 08:43:52 From PDA Permalink
Uwe Posts: 6428 Incept: 2009-01-03 19446	KD wrote.. if you're a bank I suspect that if you and I got together than started a bank, we could not get away with this stuff 'cause we're not TBTF. More reason not to to business with any TBTF bank. -Uwe- ---------- “Whenever the legislators endeavor to take away and destroy the property of the people, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience.” - John Locke 2011-01-04 08:44:16 Permalink
Docj Posts: 998 Incept: 2009-09-10 Duck & Cover	Simple - they don't want to upset their paymasters. Once you get it through your (thick, in my case) head that the entire government - from the UN and their member "states" all the way down to your local councilor or selectman - works for the banks and the moneyed elite then everything, and I mean everything, starts to make sense. ---------- The preservation of liberty depends upon the intellectual and moral character of the people. As long as knowledge and virtue are diffused generally among the body of a nation it is impossible they should be enslaved. - John Adams 2011-01-04 08:45:08 Permalink
Dashingdwl Posts: 9752 Incept: 2007-06-26 los angeles	I told you over and over this would happen. You don't spend $3 plus trillion propping up banks that you knew were lying, stealing, and self-enriching, and then turn around and nail them for doing the same. The Administration gave Holder his marching orders months ago. It's just coming out now. Oh look, the market is going up. ---------- When you are hard and disciplined, you can be principled. People fear you because they have no leverage against you. It's the truest form of Liberty. 2011-01-04 08:51:52 Permalink
Dmm219 Posts: 320 Incept: 2009-08-14	Told. Ya. So. Any one who believes there is another market crash coming due to this issue does not live in reality. 2011-01-04 08:54:15 Permalink
Mo Posts: 12158 Incept: 2007-06-26 Pa.	It's a government of the sociopaths, by the sociopaths and for the sociopaths. ---------- Welcome to Pottersville 2011-01-04 08:55:18 Permalink
Frat Posts: 1934 Incept: 2009-07-15 NKY	Wow. Just.... Wow. I got nothin'. ---------- We're ***ed. Where's Henry Bowman when you need him? 2011-01-04 08:57:32 From PDA* Permalink
Sangell Posts: 379 Incept: 2009-08-16	Business executives in Europe once had to travel to work in armored Mercedes. If they didn't the Red Brigades would blow them to pieces. I didn't think much of the Red Brigades-Baader/Meinhoff etc back then. Seemed to be cat's paws for the KGB and what had the CEO of Volkswagen or Fiat done to deserve to be killed. I really can't say that about our big bank CEOs. I mean would a drug kingpin or Mafia boss have to resort to shootings and murder if they could get the courts to do their bidding? I think not so in a sense these bankers are even worse than a traditional 'crime family' in that they act with the blessing of the state. In fact, doesn't the fact that they can do so only after paying 'protection money' to the state make the state the ultimate 'Godfather'? 2011-01-04 08:57:48 Permalink
Kamath Posts: 1539 Incept: 2009-04-04 Sweden	I'm speechless. ---------- "Yep - and that ***er didn't want to light either. I had to soak it in gasoline for a full day before that rat bastard thing would combust." - Karl Denninger ""We could not be more ill served if we had some South American tribal witch doctor shaking monkey bones at us. " - Infidel 2011-01-04 09:02:15 Permalink*
Leicestersq Posts: 221 Incept: 2009-10-12 UK	I hope that these AG's realise what is right here. If they just fine the banks, the tab gets picked up by the ordinary folks including pension scheme members, who hold the banks stock. Yet the crime here is one of control fraud by insiders at the bank. The only punishment that makes any sense is one taken out against those insiders. And if they think that keeping the banking system solvent by not prosecuting properly, is the best course of action, then they are wrong again. A lawful economy can rebuild itself after a financial meltdown. One where crime and fraud is rewarded by punishment of the innocent, can never mend. 2011-01-04 09:02:34 Permalink
Widgeon Posts: 13481 Incept: 2007-08-30 Region formerly known as the United States	Look in the Mirror. There's a Slave Looking Back at You. Not an Abstract Theoretical Slave ... but a Real Actual Slave. We're All Slaves. 2011-01-04 09:04:27 Permalink
Trades50 Posts: 4214 Incept: 2007-10-30 Land of Tax and Spend Online	Unfortunately nothing changes until people take to the streets. Talking with most people looks like that won't happen for the right reasons. ---------- When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty. - Thomas Jefferson 2011-01-04 09:06:01 Permalink
Killersdad Posts: 1035 Incept: 2008-03-27 upstate NY Online	I can't believe all 50 state AG's agree with this. There must be huge pressure being exerted to force this issue. How could this be civil and not criminal? Essentially another bank bailout with token fines that will be back door funded by the taxpayer. Will this also create a precedent that will prevent others from being able to sue and recover damages. This behavior boggles my mind. Is there no hope that the right thing will be done? I will call my AG but it will probably be a waste of time. ---------- They keep talking about drafting a Constitution for Iraq ...why don't we just give them ours? It was written by a lot of really smart guys, it has worked for over 200 years, and we're not using it anymore. 2011-01-04 09:17:02 Permalink
Raaction Posts: 397 Incept: 2008-02-06 N.W. Arizona	The numbers were crunched a long time ago and if you truly think the outcome would be any different you are naive. The die has been cast and the "machine" has barely slowed. When I say the numbers have been "crunched", I mean from every angle. The money changers have looked at this from every angle and they KNOW there will be no action taken by the American population as there are just enough people staying employed to make ends meet and just enough leech**s sponging off the system. They know the streets will not be filled with angry protest when the announcement is made. The***of this country will continue unimpeded. And it was just 4 short years ago that I thought that there were a few foolish men doing foolish things. Now, unfortunately, I cannot help but believe that a full scale assault on our nation is occurring as we sit idly by. All that is needed for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing - loosely quoted and by whom I don't know, but I am guilty. ---------- Why do I have to reap the whirlwind along side those that called down the thunder? -silverdeth 2011-01-04 09:18:35 Permalink*
Sangell Posts: 379 Incept: 2009-08-16	We've really reached an impasse here. Yves Smith had some court documents posted yesterday that seem to show that the Florida AG cannot even subpoena documents from the foreclosure mills the banks hired to prepare the perjured affidavits and forged documents necessary for their foreclosure cases. Seems the courts themselves and or the bar association have jurisdiction over this kind of thing. Then a Supreme Court ruling declared accountanting firms cannot be sued by a third party but only by the accounting firms client. So, as the Iowa AG states even as a civil matter, there is no way to get to the bottom of this story. Cannot subpoena, can't depose, can't do much of anything except watch as forged documents and perjured affidavits are submitted and, incredibly, are posted on line for the public to peruse at their leisure. 2011-01-04 09:19:58 Permalink
Mo Posts: 12158 Incept: 2007-06-26 Pa.	Quote: I can't believe all 50 state AG's agree with this. There must be huge pressure being exerted to force this issue. How could this be civil and not criminal? I'll bet they were promised state bailouts. ---------- Welcome to Pottersville 2011-01-04 09:20:07 Permalink
Goforbroke Posts: 5333 Incept: 2007-11-30 Just call me 'Comrade'	The states' need for money outweights their ~~desire~~ mandate for justice. This theme seems to run through absolutely everything that goes on these days. ---------- We have met the enemy and it is us. -- Pogo Last modified: 2011-01-04 09:32:12 by goforbroke 2011-01-04 09:21:02 Permalink
Curbyourrisk Posts: 3587 Incept: 2008-08-19 Farmingdale, NY	SERIOUSLY.......Did anyone on here actually expect a different outcome????? There is no way ANYONE of the banks will go down for this. THERE is no way anyone of the executives will serve time. THERE is no way the middle class survives this. ---------- Time is up. I hate to burst your bubble, but there is no Santa Claus, the tooth fairy does not exist and American justice does not involve the courts. 2011-01-04 09:22:45 Permalink
Dashingdwl Posts: 9752 Incept: 2007-06-26 los angeles	Holder: Prosecute any bank for this foreclosure paperwork problem, and you'll get no bailout money. Zero. None. State AG: Aye, aye sir. ---------- When you are hard and disciplined, you can be principled. People fear you because they have no leverage against you. It's the truest form of Liberty. 2011-01-04 09:23:10 Permalink
Zarathustra Posts: 5937 Incept: 2009-04-29 Funkytown	Goforbroke +100000000000. Let the never-ending powergrab continue... ---------- "And in knowing that you know nothing, that makes you the smartest of all." - Socrates 2011-01-04 09:23:35 Permalink
Corn1945 Posts: 4167 Incept: 2009-04-30	Quote: THERE is no way the middle class survives this. The middle class folks I've spoken with don't seem to give a ***. Not sure what I can do at that point. 2011-01-04 09:25:00 Permalink*

KD wrote..

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