They assaulted the Tree Of Liberty from the Left and from the Right; each shouting with Their blows:

"I know I'm right -and the Other shall see it and stop before We fell the Tree!"

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DIONYSUS: " Thou hast no knowledge of the life thou art leading; thy very existence is now a mystery to thee. " -from 'The Bacchantes' By Euripides During times of universal deceit, telli

Good luck winning without 2/3 of your base. Grab that middle. That's where the action is. Don't defend yourself against attacks that are not based in WHAT YOU WANT to talk about when the MSM is against you.

The other side is too stupid to change the fight off your strengths. Keep telling yourself that. Keep saying it.

Keep telling 2/3 of your base to STFU, stay away from politics and that they should not have the same rights as you enlightened folks do.

Hasta...

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Diversity + proximity = WAR

-The facts do not care about your narrative. The "GREAT NOTICING" continues apace.

NEXT DAY...

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DIONYSUS: " Thou hast no knowledge of the life thou art leading; thy very existence is now a mystery to thee. " -from 'The Bacchantes' By Euripides During times of universal deceit, telli

Quote:

Really? Let's be fair here. If you want to play the victim card, PLEASE provide some quotes that show us how you arrived at this conclusion.

How about this for starters.

Quote:

As long as the christians keep out of politics they will be just fine...

Did you see the Huffington Post today? $100k to destroy Glenn Beck?

I actually agree with you. No one here has in fact threatened to kill anyone. That I know of. But people like AE might as well have said, If your a Christian, do not enter politics.

If you are an Atheist of good moral character, can go to DC and stop the nonsense of wild spending, I will vote for you. If you are a Jew, the same will apply. I think the difference is morals and ethics.

Yet, people like AE are saying, if you are a Christian you can not be in government.

To me the difference is clear. I do not want a religious government, neither does Glenn Beck, and neither does the Tea Party.

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Arizona & desert gardening
http://azediblegarden.com/

Quote:

You people are so conditioned in the concept of moral equivalency that our betters in the Left rammed into your heads regarding the Cold War, you must see Christianity as the same as the Shiite/Sunni squabbles in Islam.

BS appeal to extremes.

Reread my post. I'm not making any qualifications about religious flavors or trying to present historical evidence to marginalize Christianity. I was merely pointing out the NORMATIVE nature of religion in politics. "I'm right you're wrong. That's it." just doesn't work without some kind of violence or a VERY homogeneous culture. We don't have the latter and I thought the whole point of this experiment in self-governance was to get away from violence and tyranny.

Quote:

Tell me, what rights will you enlightened folks vouchsafe those "Bible thumping troglodytes"

More appeal to extremes and self-victimization. Just because some believe that the "tent should be bigger" doesn't mean that they hate you and think you are stupid. But, the religious victim card is just about as effective as the race one...and just about as intellectually honest too.

Basically this thread continues to be a running confirmation of KD's post; "You're with us 100% or against us..."

+1000 Throxxofvron, let us not forget what party gave us the Patriot act and what party promised to kill the patriot act (or at least scale it back)

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Arizona & desert gardening
http://azediblegarden.com/

You'e with us 100% or against us...

Pure bull shit.

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Arizona & desert gardening
http://azediblegarden.com/

Medic I meant christians keeping their faith out of politics, and you know it.

Would you be cool with a Muslim congressman introducing a bill that allows some form of sharia law or some shit? Neither would I.

Did you read those posts over on Free Republic? The vitriol for "homos" and such? If those people got elected they would try to outlaw gays because it is an affront to god.

Sorry man, let me clarify, I am ok with those that have faith in whatever god, just keep it out of the government. When taken to the extreme we see what happens. (Iran, Taliban etc)

Quote:

You're with us 100% or against us...
Pure bull shit.

I mean that's how our 2 party system works...right? And that's basically what this ticker so finely elucidated.

TPTB who rob us blind while we fight over the ancillary and ultimately meaningless "cultural details". Even better, we get to stir up the "hate" pot and expend all of our boiling-over frustrations and anger against one another in order to keep us occupied.

Honestly, they WANT US to be more worried about our "godless gay liberal"/"crazy gun-toting bible-thumping" [pick one] neighbors than who is in the pockets of our elected officials. It's how the whole game works...at the human level we're all WAY more similar than different. God forbid we ALL unite and start looking for the REAL enemies.

The funny and ironic thing about this thread is how it played out right into that theme. I mean, any person who agreed ended up becoming a "liberal" or anti-religious hater. In reality, these "labels" provide very little evidence of any one individuals "true colors" but they do end up allowing for a WHOLE LOT ASSUMPTION and MISCOMMUNICATION!

Nice backpeddle.

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Diversity + proximity = WAR

-The facts do not care about your narrative. The "GREAT NOTICING" continues apace.

Quote:

You'e with us 100% or against us...

Pure bull shit.

Medic, I saw a lot of that in that thread on FR, it is very disturbing, and I am sure you probably do not agree with it either.

I really do not understand the christian hate for the gays, I read another thread over there where they eviscerated that Ken Melhmen guy or whatever his name is, did not matter that he got Bush elected, only matters what his sexual preference is and that he should be ostracized for it.

Which party did give us the PATRIOT Act?

Passed the Senate 98-1
Passed the House 357-66

House Dems 145-62
House GOP 211-3

That is enough to get a Constitutional Amendment by either party's votes.

I also note that the 109tf, 110th & 111th Congresses have made no effert to repeal it.

Now, which party gave us the PATRIOT Act?

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Diversity + proximity = WAR

-The facts do not care about your narrative. The "GREAT NOTICING" continues apace.

Quote:

Now, which party gave us the PATRIOT Act?

My point exactly.

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Arizona & desert gardening
http://azediblegarden.com/

Quote:

I really do not understand the christian hate for the gays

That's because you have made and incorrect assumption.

Quote:

I really do not understand the christian hate for the gays

You are being fooled by fools.

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Arizona & desert gardening
http://azediblegarden.com/

Is it hatred or refusal to accept their behavior?

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Diversity + proximity = WAR

-The facts do not care about your narrative. The "GREAT NOTICING" continues apace.

One more thing about the Nicevill Big Tent Revival...

Niceville is located a stones throw from the county with the most churches per capita in the US (Santa Rosa, Florida).

You can have a bake sale, cribbage convention, or dwarf tossing contest and the aftermath will likely be a bunch of people talking about "socially conservative" stuff. Look at where it is located and the people most likely to attend.

IF the same TP rally was in Seattle, and you had three people that could recognize a Bible without trying to don a radio-active protection suit, I'd be shocked. In Seattle, you would have a bunch of people talking about how much their house is worth and how smart they are. Would I correctly conclude that observing a TP rally in Seattle that the TP movement has been hijscked by self-congratulating arrogant pricks?

No.

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Diversity + proximity = WAR

-The facts do not care about your narrative. The "GREAT NOTICING" continues apace.

Eleua: Exactly how does 'their behavior' infringe upon Your Rights?

If One group wishes to curtail or deny the Rights of the Other the aggressor in the situation is ???

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DIONYSUS: " Thou hast no knowledge of the life thou art leading; thy very existence is now a mystery to thee. " -from 'The Bacchantes' By Euripides During times of universal deceit, telli

Is Glen Beck part of Tea Party? Is attack by left on Glen Beck attack on Tea Party?

Quote:

I really do not understand the christian hate for the gays

Quote:

That's because you have made and incorrect assumption.

Quote:

You are being fooled by fools.

Quote:

Is it hatred or refusal to accept their behavior?

Quote:

self-congratulating arrogant pricks

Around and around it goes...where it stops nobody knows!

We all know that nobody is gonna change peoples minds about this stuff. The only ASSURED OUTCOME in these type of discussions is mutual animosity. Why continue to feed it?

Ae-

Your comment that as long as Christians keep out of Politics they'll be okay is belied by what has happened in this country over the past 20 years.

The push-back against Christianity and all things Christian has been enormous.

Witness the stoopid injunctions against saying "Merry Christmas".

Last Xmas I actually got a "Christmas card" from someone that said ONLY "Happy Hannakuh" on it.

Okay. She celebrates Xmas and so do I. Far as I know, she's never celebrated Hannukah. I have, but, for me anyway, hannukah is no christmas and I need a Happy Hannukah card for....what exactly?

Just something to look for in next years "Christmas Card" batch. Could be a new trend.

Throxx,

It isn't.

It is the gays that are trying to change millenia of social customs, not the Christians. It is the gays that are rubbing their behavior in the faces of people that want nothing to do with it and daring them to do something.

In the US we have a cultural norm of tolerance. That's a two way street.

If you want to shove a carrot up your ass and listen to Jefferson Airplane at 3am, that's your right. If you do it in such a fashion that I can't reasonably distance myself from it, you are not holding up your end of the bargain.

Gays went from the "love that dare not speak its name" to the "love that won't shut up." They are actively pushing their lifestyle in neutural areas of our society (public schools and civil governance) as to make those that disagree with it being forced to either accept it or actively oppose it.

If two guys want to play house and pound ass, NOBODY cares. IF they want to intrude on social norms that have been outside their domain for the entirety of Western Civilization, you have to expect some blowback. Pushing back to retain the culture isn't necessarily religious, but anti-religious zealots love to construe religious bias in everything religious people do so as to trump their actions with the higher secular ethic. It's essentially the "race card" of social constructs.

A few weeks ago, I put Pd down pretty hard when she was presuming the hatred Christians have for gays and what is said in churches. In 25 years of church attendance, I have yet to hear one sermon on the evils of homosexuality. Most Chritians (certainly not all) have a pretty wide tolerance for gays to do whatever they want, so long as they keep the other half of the deal when it comes to tolerance. Most gays do. Enough gays do not, which is where the problem lies.

When I was a teen, the San Francisco gays would have a whopper of a "Gay Pride" parade in San Francisco. It was their thing and nobody in the 'burbs really cared. They tried to do one in Concord, California and they got lots of blowback from the community and their permits were ultimately denied.

It wasn't that the Concord gay population needed to express themselves. They had SF for that. It was the avant-guarde SF gays that had to rub their gayness in the faces of more traditional families in the 'burbs.

That's what pisses everyone off.

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Diversity + proximity = WAR

-The facts do not care about your narrative. The "GREAT NOTICING" continues apace.

Around and around it goes because what is a Christian to me is different to him. He is basing his definition of Christian on some hateful comment that he read on another website.

I would be willing to bet that a lot of those comments are posted by people that don't really have that view, would not say it publicly, or just kids inciting to incite. Yes there may be a few, but most Christians do not hate gays.

Hence, being fooled by fools.

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Arizona & desert gardening
http://azediblegarden.com/

You did not answer My question, Eleua.

People have every right to express Themselves in a free society.

You can praise Your God in public can't You?
Wear Religious Symbols on clothes and around Your neck.

Exactly how does 'their behavior' infringe upon Your Rights?

Social Customs?

Social Customs evolve constantly as People decide for Themselves what Customs they wish to practice in a free society.

Resistance to changes in Social Customs are Who's problem?

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DIONYSUS: " Thou hast no knowledge of the life thou art leading; thy very existence is now a mystery to thee. " -from 'The Bacchantes' By Euripides During times of universal deceit, telli

Ae-

check out http://www.gaypatriot.net . Or http://hillbuzz.org

The portrayal of Christian Conservatives as rabid homophobes is vastly over-rated.

But it *does* make a GREAT Dem Talking Point.